On this episode of The No Normal Show, Desirée Duncan and Chris Bevolo explore how financial pressures are reshaping the CMO role in health systems — from proving ROI to surviving budget cuts — and what it means for the future of healthcare marketing leadership. Along the way, they swap takes on how young adults are engaging with healthcare and debate ChatGPT’s growing role in usability. Plus, get an inside look at the exclusive 2026 Joe Public Retreat in sunny South Beach, where AI will take center stage. Tune in now.
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AI just got faster, smarter, and a lot more… agentic. In this episode of The No Normal Show, UChicago Medicine CMO Andy Chang joins us to talk about the tech that’s rewriting the rules for healthcare marketing. We discuss the rise of AI “agents” that can book your appointment before you’ve finished your coffee, to why websites as we know them might not survive. Also, Andy shares how his team is building a frictionless, hyper-personalized patient experience. We cover the future of MarTech stacks, the end of one-size-fits-all healthcare, and yes—why video games are surprisingly great for family bonding. The future’s here, are you ready to play? Tune in now.
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In this episode of The No Normal Show, hosts Stephanie Wierwille and Chris Bevolo explore one of the most pressing challenges in healthcare: the decline of centralized medical authority and the growing complexity of health information. From “health-conscious” marketing claims to vaccine skepticism, they unpack the cultural and psychological factors contributing to shifting perceptions of trust. With insights from the Joe Public 2030 report, the discussion highlights how healthcare marketers must evolve—from relying on traditional messaging to designing experiences that meet consumers where they are. Tune in now.
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Join our upcoming webinar, The Future of the Health System Chief Marketing Officer, to learn how to measure marketing performance, align metrics with organizational goals, and present impactful data to the C-suite. Register here.
Articles to read:
AdventHealth employees surprise coworker with bridal shower
Mayo, Nvidia launch AI supercomputer to diagnose diseases more quickly
Poppi’s $8.9M Settlement Sends a Warning to Wellness Marketers
In this episode of The No Normal Show, we’re pulling back the curtain on who actually shapes decisions in the C-suite and why Chief Marketing Officers might be losing ground to the rising influence of Chief Communications Officers. We’re calling it the Karolina Effect, and it’s changing the power dynamics inside health systems. We also ask if Chipotle has lost its sizzle, and whether influencer marketing is shifting from storytelling to sales-driven chaos as affiliate links and TikTok shops take over. Tune in to hear what it all means for the future of healthcare marketing.
Subscribe to The No Normal Rewind, our newsletter featuring a mashup of the boldest ideas, sharpest takes, and most rewind-worthy moments from our podcast — right here.
Join our upcoming webinar, The Future of the Health System Chief Marketing Officer, to learn how to measure marketing performance, align metrics with organizational goals, and present impactful data to the C-suite. Register here.
Healthcare might be serious business—but who says it has to be boring? In this episode of The No Normal Show, Desirée Duncan and Chris Bevolo ask the question: if banks can sponsor Happy Gilmore 2, why can’t hospitals show up in pop culture too? The duo also explore their Emmy hot takes, Mattel's diabetic Barbie and Mount Sinai's game-changing caregiver clinic. It's time to talk about the unexpected ways healthcare brands can and must integrate into culture, Tune in now.
In this episode of The No Normal Show, Desirée, Stephanie, and guest Victoria Davis unpack the cultural, emotional, and operational weight women carry in their health journeys—and how brands can finally meet them where they are. From weight stigma at check-ins to body image pressure fueled by TikTok trends and GLP-1 drugs, we explore how marketing can either add to the noise or cut through with empathy and clarity. If you want to connect with women as the Chief Health Officers of their households and reach the people actually making the decisions, it’s time to rethink the message, the medium, and the moment. Tune in now.
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Artificial intelligence is shaking up healthcare marketing and sparking big questions about trust. On this episode of The No Normal Show, Stephanie Wierwille, Desiree Duncan, and Chris Bevolo dig into the clash between innovation and ethics, from the wild plot of Mountain Head to new insights from OpenAI and MIT. They look at how consumers really feel about AI in branding, the growing risks of deepfake content, and how health marketers can leverage new technology without losing credibility. If you’re navigating the AI revolution in healthcare, tune in.
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Is the role of the CMO ready for a reset? On this episode of The No Normal Show, Desirée, Stephanie, and Chris reflect on this year’s Cannes Lions festival, which they call the Met Gala of marketing, where headlines about AI and creativity sparked plenty of conversation. The team also looks at what Best Buy’s exit from Current Health signals for healthcare disruptors and the ongoing shifts in the Funnel Wars.
At the center of the discussion is the idea that the modern CMO needs to move beyond just being the voice of the customer. The real opportunity is becoming the Leadership Whisperer — someone who understands the bigger market context and can help shape how an organization responds to economic shifts, policy changes, cultural trends, and emerging consumer behaviors. Being the Leadership Whisperer may not be easy, but it could be the edge healthcare marketing needs to keep pace with the world outside its walls. Tune in and take notes. The future is listening.
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Show notes:
Best Buy Divests Current Health
Download our latest report, The Future of the CMO
A new approach to employer health care? Give workers money to buy their own plan
In this episode of The No Normal Show, hosts Stephanie Wierwille and Desirée Duncan reflect on the themes shaping healthcare marketing at the mid-year mark. They dig into the rise of vibe marketing, why video continues to dominate, and how internal communications is becoming mission-critical for both employee and patient retention. It’s a candid pulse check on what’s real, what’s changing, and what healthcare marketers should be paying attention to right now.
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Stephanie and Desirée discuss the real story behind Google’s new AI Overviews—and what it means for healthcare marketers. Are websites still worth it? Is SEO over? And how do you stay visible when search engines are rewriting the rules? Along the way, they dig into what Apple’s AI reveal signals, what OpenAI’s latest moves mean for marketers, and why the old-school idea of “advertising” is quickly evolving. It’s a fast, fun ride through the future of search, strategy, and staying relevant in the age of AI.
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Author and podcast host Scott Galloway says brand is dead—and a lot of marketers are in a frenzy because of it. In this episode of The No Normal Show, Stephanie, Chris, and Desirée dig into the viral debate and unpack what “brand” really means in today’s world—especially in healthcare. Spoiler alert: it’s not all about logos and ad spend, and no, it’s definitely not dead. The team breaks down Oura Ring’s bold “Give Us the Finger” campaign and how it flips conventional narratives about aging, health, and wearable tech. Tune in as we separate hype from reality, marketing myths from strategy, and help you rethink how brand still drives value in 2025 and beyond.
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On this episode of The No Normal Show, we jump headfirst into HBO Max’s brand whiplash and why identity confusion can be a slow burn for brand trust. Leaning into the theme of brand reputation with our new TheFuture of the CMO report in hand, Desirée, Chris, and Chief Communications Officer at BPD, Ryan Colaianni, highlight what it means to be a healthcare CMO’s in 2025.
Should CMOs stay in their marketing lane, or take the comms wheel and drive reputation, strategy, and even policy influence? The team gets into the tension between doing more and doing it well—and why the structure of the CMO’s team might be the real power play. This episode is your roadmap to relevance. Tune in now.
Download our latest report, The Future of the CMO.
Subscribe to The No Normal Rewind, our newsletter featuring a mashup of the boldest ideas, sharpest takes, and most rewind-worthy moments from our podcast — right here.
YouTube is transforming into a streaming powerhouse and the Chief Marketing Officer role is evolving. This episode of The No Normal Show explores the quiet, but powerful, shifts shaping healthcare marketing today.
Stephanie and Desirée discuss how the focus of marketing is moving beyond traditional brand buzz and viral moments—and toward something more enduring: influence through community, trust, and relevance. They reflect on how SHIFT Nursing, a collaboration between BPD and the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation, built momentum beyond traditional campaigning by helping real nurse leaders drive conversation and change from the inside out. While mass reach can still drive broad impact, meaningful influence is increasingly coming from smaller, trusted circles—where the right voices carry the message forward.
If you're rethinking how to measure success, or how to create marketing that sticks, this episode offers insights into the power of storytelling, specificity, and shared ownership.
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"The boring spot in healthcare is taken," says Nicole Baxter, Chief Brand Officer at HCA Healthcare. She shows up every day with bold brand ideas that move healthcare beyond the sea of sameness. We sat down with Nicole for a candid, high-energy conversation on what it takes to build a great brand from the inside-out.
Nicole shares her career story from Canadian roots to becoming one of the most visionary brand voices in the industry. She shares how brands like Snoop Dogg, the WNBA, and even Wonder Bread shape her thinking—and why innovation, risk-taking, and emotional relevance are non-negotiables in today’s healthcare landscape.
From internal engagement to external impact, Nicole reminds us why listening deeply, leading with empathy, and saying “yes” to crazy ideas might be the best branding strategy of all.
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In this episode of The No Normal Show, Desiree Duncan and Chris Bevolo highlight the cultural crossfire brands are navigating today. From Nike’s controversial “Never Again” billboard to NYU Langone’s controversial Super Bowl ad, they explore how even well-intentioned moves can result in backlash in a world of unapologetic commentary and hypersensitive audiences. Fresh from his recent Becker’s and HMPS panels to duo recap conference trends and topics — highlighting AI disruption and the marketing ROI challenge that just won’t go away. For healthcare marketers trying to lead bold while avoiding missteps, this episode is for you.
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Mass media is going in a different direction. Livestreams from Beyoncé’s Cowboy Carter tour didn’t come from networks—they came from fans, forming a holistic approach to community engagement. In this episode of The No Normal Show, Desirée, Stephanie, and guest Mario Nichols, producer of The No Normal Show, unpack the shift happening in media, influence, and consumer trust. This episode digs into fan-powered content, the White House pushing AI into public education, and the transformation of mass media. Niche creators and everyday voices are now shaping public opinion. So, how can your brand level up?
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Gen Z is ditching smartphones, digital clutter, and nonstop notifications in favor of a simpler, more nostalgic life—and brands need to pay attention. In this episode of the No Normal Show, Stephanie, Desirée, and Chris unpack the rise of "digital minimalism" (or Digman, if you dare) and what it signals for marketers trying to stay culturally relevant. Plus, they connect the dots between Kendrick Lamar's culture-defining moments, Gatorade's newest campaign win, and Meta’s latest monopoly drama. Ready to rethink your marketing strategy for a world that’s tired of the scroll? Tune in now.
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Our new white paper, The Future of the CMO, is now available! Download our latest report here.
BPD’s latest report outlines the threats facing CMOs—and reveals the bold opportunities to lead, influence, and transform from the inside out. In this episode, Stephanie, Desirée, and Chris take a deep dive into The Future of the CMO, BPDs latest report, unpacking how marketing leaders can expand their influence, claim greater value, and lead transformation inside the health system enterprise. Plus: a spirited debate on speculative fiction, Des’ surprising pick, and why metaphors might just be magic. Subscribe to the No Normal Rewind for early access to all of BPD’s thought leadership—and a front-row seat to the future.
Check out our latest report: "The Future of the CMO"
There’s A LOT out there that’s swirling into the pressure cooker that is today’s healthcare economy. On this episode of TheNo Normal Show, Stephanie, Desirée, and Chris break down the cascading impact of policy shifts and economic trends—from DEI backlash and NIH cuts to tariff-induced inflation and Medicaid shakeups. What does this all means for CMOs, marketers, and the future of care access in America? Plus, a farewell to White Lotus, the curious case of a pina colada coffee creamer, and the underrated brilliance of Black Mirror’s health-tech commentary. This episode is quite sunny with a chance of rain. Tune in now.
Our new white paper, The Future of the CMO, will be available early to subscribers! You can sign up here or even subscribe via BPD’s LinkedIn.
The creative bar is high—and healthcare marketing is rising to meet it. Award season is about more than applause; it’s proof that bold ideas with real impact matter. This episode is your backstage pass to the sharpest thinking and fearless creativity in healthcare today. Stephanie, Desirée, and BPD’s Chief Creative Officer Mindy Adams unpack what it takes to stand out—from judging the Effies to pushing SHIFT Nursing for a Webby. Plus, a Cannes Lions roundup (yes, even the cement company campaign).
Vote SHIFT. Name your AI. Throw an unhinged dinner party. Press play.
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