In Part 2 of our conversation with Neil Graham, Chief Revenue Officer at Disqo, we dive deeper into how modern CROs must rethink their org design, marketing execution, and AI integration strategies to stay competitive in 2025 and beyond. Neil shares why curiosity, humility, and bias for action are now non-negotiables; and how his team is operationalizing those values inside a flat, fast-moving GTM system. From building AI-generated deal strategy sessions to deploying 24/7 agents on the website, Neil unpacks the real-world tools and team behaviors that are reshaping sales and marketing execution. This episode is packed with tactical insights for CROs leading through change. What You’ll LearnFlatter Orgs, Bolder Execution: How Disqo’s three-layer model speeds up decisions and drives alignment across marketing, sales, and delivery.Non-Negotiables in Revenue Teams: Why curiosity, humility, and action orientation matter more than ever, and how to screen for them.AI as a Revenue Multiplier: How Disqo uses AI for outbound personalization, content creation, and automated deal intelligence.Coaching in the AI Era: How Neil’s RevOps team leads enablement through data-driven strategy docs and always-on insights.Creating New Roles for the AI Age: Why Disqo now has a dedicated AI strategy lead embedded in RevOps, and how other CROs can follow suit.Key TopicsScaling outbound without bloating headcountRedefining RevOps to include data, process, enablement, and AI ownershipDesigning a leadership team that balances vision and executionThe future of SDR and BDR roles in an AI-enabled GTMUsing AI agents for 24/7 coverage and real-time buyer insightsBuilding culture through feedback, modeling, and EQ-based hiringGuest Spotlight: Neil Graham Neil Graham is the Chief Revenue Officer at Disqo. A proven growth operator and revenue architect, Neil has helped scale iconic brands like Salesforce, Siebel, and Jive. At Disqo, he’s building a flat, AI-accelerated GTM machine that prizes speed, ownership, and alignment over legacy hierarchy. Resources & MentionsCompany: DisqoFrameworks: MedPick, DSF (Disqo Success Framework)Sales Tools: Gong, Clay, ChatGPT, AI agentsLeadership Inspiration: Carl Schachter, Eli Cohen, John BarrowsBook: Emotional Intelligence by Daniel Goleman🎧 Listen now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, we’re joined by Neil Graham, Chief Revenue Officer at Disqo and a seasoned revenue leader whose career spans Salesforce, Siebel, Jive, and Telem. Neil shares a ground-level view of what it takes to lead, scale, and modernize revenue organizations in an era where traditional sales playbooks are no longer enough. From breaking out of funnel-stage rigidity to building flat organizations that prioritize curiosity, Neil walks through the changes CROs must embrace to stay ahead. He also shares how Disqo is rethinking GTM structure and leveraging AI to drive personalization, speed, and operational clarity; without drowning in tools. What You’ll LearnWhy the Playbook is Obsolete: What Neil really means when he says the old models no longer work, and what replaces them.Lightweight Rigor at Scale: How to build process and alignment without slowing teams down.From Bottoms-Up to Top-Down TAM: How Disqo blends relationship selling with TAM-led targeting for scale.Curiosity as Culture: Why curiosity is a non-negotiable leadership trait in flat, fast-moving GTM orgs.Leading Through Change: How to coach teams to self-govern, move fast, and stay mission-aligned in a no-layer org model.Key TopicsBuilding sales organizations without bureaucracy or bloatAligning marketing, sales, and success teams around business outcomesUsing AI to power real-time customer insight and hyper-relevant outboundFlattening GTM structures for speed, ownership, and clarityCreating cultures where experimentation and impact are rewardedGuest Spotlight: Neil Graham Neil Graham is the Chief Revenue Officer at Disqo and a proven sales leader with decades of experience scaling GTM organizations from Series A to post-IPO. Known for his ability to bring structure without red tape, Neil has helped some of the most recognized B2B SaaS names balance scale with agility in high-growth phases. Resources & MentionsCompany: DisqoFramework: DSF (Disqo Success Framework)Sales Tools: Gong, Clay, ChatGPTBooks & Influence: MedPick methodology, Salesforce early days, AI-led sales enablement🎧 Listen now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In Part 2 of our conversation with Josh Hoffman, we explore the leadership mindset required to thrive in moments of high-pressure change, like mergers, long enterprise cycles, and AI-driven disruption. Josh shares how sales teams can stay grounded in customer value, build trust through co-created plans, and lead with consistency; regardless of who owns the company or what the logo says. We also talk about the real-world impact of AI on sales effectiveness, onboarding, and go-to-market readiness. What You’ll Learn:Leading Through Change: How to stabilize culture and focus teams during M&A, leadership transitions, or high-stakes GTM shiftsMutual Action Plans that Work: Why aligning around a co-created calendar is a simple but powerful tool for accountability and momentumConsistency Over Chaos: How sticking to your core value proposition helps drown out internal and external noiseReal AI Use Cases: How Josh and his team use AI for onboarding, writing, analysis, and market research—without replacing human judgmentLeadership in Modern Sales Orgs: The behavioral traits that inspire performance, loyalty, and resilienceKey Topics:Sales leadership in high-pressure, transitional environmentsUsing backward-planning and mutual calendars for deal velocityStaying aligned on value across long sales cyclesCultural consistency across internal and client-facing teamsAI for productivity, market intelligence, and GTM strategyEmbracing humility and continuous learning as a CROGuest Spotlight: Josh Hoffman Josh is Chief Revenue Officer at Totus Rx and a long-time leader in B2B revenue organizations. He’s built and led sales teams across tech, telecom, and compliance industries, with a focus on building high-trust teams and delivering real value to customers. Josh is known for his practical, human-centered leadership style, especially in complex, high-stakes environments. Resources & Mentions:Book: The Challenger SaleBook: SPIN SellingLeaders Mentioned: Mark Anderson, Russ Reeder, Todd Abbott, Mike Jenner, Joe BurtonFollow Josh Hoffman on LinkedIn for more insights on sales leadership and culture.🎧 Listen now and subscribe to Selling the Cloud to hear more from enterprise GTM leaders shaping the future of sales. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, we sit down with Josh Hoffman, a seasoned go-to-market leader who has guided sales transformations at Dell, Avaya, Poly, Datto, and now ControlCase. Known for his “sell-with” philosophy, Josh shares what it really means to drive symbiotic outcomes, where sellers, partners, and customers win together. He unpacks lessons from decades of leading in high-stakes environments, including mergers, market pivots, and rapid scale, and makes the case for consistency, humility, and emotional intelligence in modern sales leadership. From shifting away from zero-sum thinking to building customer-aligned mutual action plans, this episode is a masterclass in outcome-based selling and team-driven success. What You’ll LearnSell-With vs. Sell-To: Why Josh believes the most successful sellers don’t “close deals”, they solve problems alongside the customer.How to Build Mutual Action Plans: Practical ways to bring partners and clients to the same side of the table from day one.The Role of AI in Sales Coaching: How Josh’s teams are using AI for prompt writing, context synthesis, and deal prep, without losing the human element.Coaching Through Change: Why consistency, not charisma, helps teams thrive through high-pressure acquisitions and pivots.From Manufacturing to CRO: Josh’s story of going from putting screws in motherboards at Dell to building global GTM teams, and what shaped him along the way.Key TopicsTransforming sales cultures from transactional to consultativeTeaching sellers to ask better questions, and when to talk lessWhy top sales leaders reduce the distance between themselves and the AECoaching through ambiguity and building career-defining momentsWhy consistent behavior builds trust in times of changeUsing AI to augment, not replace, frontline coaching and prepGuest Spotlight: Josh Hoffman Josh Hoffman is the Chief Revenue Officer at ControlCase and a proven sales leader with over two decades of experience building high-performance teams. With a track record of leading in moments of transformation, Josh is passionate about coaching sellers to exceed what they thought was possible, through shared success, customer obsession, and scalable systems of growth. Resources & MentionsBook: The Qualified Sales Leader by John McMahonBook: FYI: For Your Improvement by Korn FerryCompany: ControlCase (compliance & audit automation)AI Tool Mention: Grammarly, prompt engineeringLeadership Inspiration: Todd Abbott, Mike Jenner, Mark Anderson🎧 Listen now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In Part 2 of our conversation with Max Elster, Co-Founder and CEO of Minoa, we go deeper into how sales teams are actually operationalizing outcome-based selling; at scale. Max shares how revenue teams at companies like Vanta are moving beyond founder-led, feature-centric narratives, and building scalable, repeatable playbooks rooted in customer outcomes, business impact, and data-backed storytelling. Whether you’re leading a 10-person sales team or a 1,000-person GTM org, this conversation will help you reimagine enablement, coach for value, and build business cases that win over CFOs. What You’ll LearnVanta’s Transition from Features to Outcomes: How CRO Stevie Case transformed Vanta’s narrative, and drove shorter cycles, higher win rates, and stronger executive engagement by focusing the team on value-led discovery and storytelling.Why Business Cases Shouldn’t Be Optional: Hear how teams went from building 10 business cases per quarter to over 500, without hiring hundreds of SEs, and how that shift boosted win rates by up to 15 percentage points.Teaching Reps to Think Like CFOs: Max explains how the best sales teams equip champions to model ROI and outcomes with buyers, not for them, and why the strongest business cases are co-owned with the finance team.How AI Accelerates Discovery, Coaching, and Differentiation: From call summaries to intent signals to customer benchmarks, Max shows how LLMs and predictive tools are giving reps the context to build relevance at scale, without losing the human touch.Key TopicsFrom founder-led sales to repeatable revenue enginesVanta’s shift to value-led selling, and what it unlockedBuilding outcome plans that close deals fasterWhy the CRO’s best insights come from AEsCoaching for customer outcomes, not product demosHow AI is reshaping forecasting, discovery, and enablementThe real future of revenue leadership in an AI worldGuest Spotlight: Max Elster Max Elster is the Co-Founder and CEO of Minoa, a revenue platform helping companies scale value-based sales across the deal cycle. With a decade of experience in AI and B2B SaaS, Max works with companies like Vanta, Cognite, and others to operationalize value intelligence, from discovery to renewal. Resources & MentionsBook: The Qualified Sales Leader by John McMahonCompany: VantaMax Elster: LinkedIn | Email: max@minoa.io🎧 Listen now and subscribe to Selling the Cloud wherever you get your podcasts. Stay tuned for next week’s episode! See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Max Elster, Co-Founder and CEO of Minoa, joins co-hosts Mark Petruzzi and KK Anderson to explore what B2B revenue leaders often miss: a clear, consistent understanding of why they win. Max introduces the concept of a Value Intelligence Layer, a data-driven framework that links discovery, business cases, and outcomes into a single narrative that everyone from SDRs to CROs can use. Drawing from years of experience across SaaS and enterprise sales, Max shares how leading GTM teams are moving away from feature pitching and toward outcome-led selling, especially in a world where AI has made building software easier, and differentiation harder. From strengthening discovery questions to creating scalable outcome playbooks, this episode is packed with tactical ideas for revenue leaders rethinking how they sell in the age of AI. What You’ll LearnThe “Why We Win” Blindspot: Why many sales orgs still can’t answer the most important question, and how that gap leads to poor qualification, forecasting, and deal execution.From Features to Outcomes: How modern buyers evaluate value, and why understanding customer priorities matters more than your internal product roadmap.Creating the Value Intelligence Layer: How to unify customer impact, product usage, sales stages, and discovery insights into a single GTM operating model.Scaling Outcome-Led Playbooks: What it takes to align SDRs, AEs, SEs, and CS teams around a shared value narrative from day zero to renewal.AI as a Differentiator (Not a Replacement): Why the best teams use AI to personalize engagement, not to automate it, and how AI helps surface deeper buyer context.Key TopicsWhy most GTM teams don’t know why they winBuilding discovery questions that lead to business casesEmbedding outcomes into CRM and sales stagesCreating a “value intelligence” system across teamsHow AI and call data can power more relevant sales motionsTurning post-sale value into pre-sale advantageAligning playbooks across SDRs, AEs, SEs, and CSMsGuest Spotlight: Max Elster Max Elster is the Co-Founder and CEO of Minoa, a SaaS company helping revenue teams operationalize their value story. With a background in B2B software and product development, Max built Manoa to bridge the gap between feature-led selling and outcome-driven growth. His team helps sales orgs unify discovery, use cases, and customer impact into one connected system. Resources & MentionsBook: The Qualified Sales Leader by John McMahonCompany: Minoa.io Max’s LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/maxelster🎧 Listen now and subscribe to Selling the Cloud wherever you get your podcasts. Stay tuned for Part 2 with Max Elster, dropping next week! See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In Part 2 of our conversation with Steve Smith, Chief Revenue Officer at Live Oak Fiber, we go deeper into how his team is scaling with both agility and authenticity—blending AI, community engagement, and a customer-first mindset to win in a highly commoditized telecom market. Steve unpacks what it really means to lead with transparency, build a culture that thrives across residential and B2B markets, and design a sales engine that delivers personalized value at scale. From t-shirt cannons to AI-assisted prospecting, it’s clear: growth happens when you meet your customers where they are—and actually understand who they are. What You’ll LearnCompeting Beyond the Product: Why the best way to differentiate is not what you sell—but how you serve.Human + AI Prospecting: Steve shares how Live Oak’s team blends digital ads, field outreach, and AI signals to achieve 80%+ MQL conversion.Leveraging Customer Context: How insights like home square footage and pool size help personalize campaigns—and why trust starts before the first call.Net Promoter as a North Star: The cultural and operational moves that helped Live Oak achieve a 76 NPS score—higher than Apple.Culture-Driven Growth: Why hiring “athletes,” not just resumes, is key to building high-performance sales teams in uncertain markets.AI Without the Hype: How Steve’s team uses AI practically—from outage alerts to upgrade prompts—without losing the human connection.Key TopicsGTM in both residential and business segmentsCreating “shock & awe” customer experiencesMapping Day 0 strategies with local event engagementDesigning growth systems that work across sales channelsUsing CRM, digital behavior, and AI for smarter targetingBalancing automation with local, white-glove serviceOperationalizing culture in sales teams and hiring practicesGuest Spotlight: Steve Smith Steve Smith is the Chief Revenue Officer at Live Oak Fiber, where he leads a people-first, tech-enabled go-to-market strategy across residential, MDU, and commercial segments. With more than 25 years of experience in telecom, Steve is known for his bold talent bets, operational creativity, and unwavering customer obsession. Resources & MentionsBook: Good to Great by Jim CollinsBook: Blink by Malcolm GladwellInspiration: The Savannah BananasSales Concept: “People don’t buy drill bits. They buy holes.”🎧 Listen now and subscribe to Selling the Cloud wherever you get your podcasts. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Steve Smith, Chief Revenue Officer at Live Oak Fiber, joins co-hosts Mark Petruzzi and KK Anderson to share what it really takes to stand out in a commoditized market. Drawing from 25+ years of telecom and GTM leadership, Steve reveals how Live Oak is building a “fiercely local” go-to-market model powered by customer obsession, simplicity, and a people-first sales culture. From recruiting talent outside the industry to treating broadband like a luxury retail experience, Steve breaks down how to differentiate when your product looks the same as everyone else’s on paper, and why NPS scores in the 70s are possible when you design everything around the end user. What You’ll LearnHow to Compete in a Commodity Market: Why Live Oak avoids tech jargon and positions packages around home square footage—because customers don’t care about speeds, they care about experiences.Hiring Outside the Box: Why Steve hires from Louis Vuitton and paddleboard shops, not just telecom resumes—and how that decision drives creativity and customer care.Fiercely Local GTM: Learn how a hyperlocal mindset builds trust, unlocks referrals, and builds brand advocacy—especially in overlooked communities.Customer Experience that Rivals Apple: How Live Oak’s white-glove service and full-time technicians boost NPS to 76 (compared to cable companies’ scores below zero).Product Simplicity That Wins: How pricing transparency and a “price-for-life” model inspired by the Savannah Bananas builds loyalty and eliminates churn frustration.Key TopicsBuilding a customer-first sales cultureDifferentiating when your product is a utilitySegmenting sales teams by audience (residential, MDU, SMB)Why most broadband companies have a bad reputation—and how to flip itLocal community engagement as a growth strategyMetrics that matter: NPS, feedback loops, and service consistencyGuest Spotlight: Steve Smith Steve Smith is the Chief Revenue Officer at Live Oak Fiber, where he leads go-to-market strategy across residential, business, and MDU channels. A veteran telecom executive with a passion for customer-first innovation, Steve is helping redefine broadband with a culture that starts and ends with people—both inside and outside the business. Resources & MentionsBook: Good to Great by Jim CollinsBook: Start with Why by Simon SinekInspiration: Savannah Bananas (yes, really!)🎧 Listen now and subscribe to Selling the Cloud wherever you get your podcasts. Stay tuned for Part 2 with Steve next week! See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In Part 2 of this Selling the Cloud episode, Jamie Wilkinson, CEO of Smart4Cloud.ai, continues his insightful conversation with Mark Petruzzi and KK Anderson on how today’s revenue teams must evolve beyond job specs and tech stacks. From building integrated, cross-functional orgs to navigating partner ecosystems, Jamie breaks down how human-centered leadership and honest business assessment unlock true scalability. He also shares the key attributes that define top sales leaders and how to spot high-impact talent in any market. What You’ll Learn:Cross-Functional Alignment is a Growth Lever: Why modern revenue teams can’t operate in silos and how top-performing orgs build “fluidity” between sales, finance, tech, and marketing.Humanizing the Hiring Process: How Jamie’s commitment model goes beyond résumés to find high-performing candidates who align with the company’s story—not just the bullet points.AI Isn’t the Enemy or the Answer: Jamie shares a grounded take on AI: it’s not about fear or hype, but about how humans apply it to improve real lives and sales performance.Build or Buy? Market Expansion Strategy: Jamie discusses when to build internally vs. leverage partner ecosystems, and why brutal honesty is the real unlock for scale.Agility, Honesty, and Culture: The traits Jamie believes will define successful GTM teams over the next 12–18 months.Key Topics:Aligning technical, sales, and product leadershipHow to recruit talent that thrives in integrated orgsGetting past fear-based narratives around AIInternal vs. external capability buildingLeadership traits that matter in “normal” marketsHow to spot people with “G.A.S.” (Givers who actually… care)Guest Spotlight: Jamie Wilkinson Jamie Wilkinson is the Founder and CEO of Smart4Cloud.ai, a human-first revenue talent partner for modern B2B teams. With deep experience in building technical + sales hybrid teams, Jamie brings practical wisdom and a no-BS approach to growing revenue orgs that work. Resources & Mentions:Part 1 of Jamie Wilkinson’s episodeGuest Mention: Napoleon Baligan, founder of 1-800-MattressReference Book: To Sell is Human (by implication)Podcast: Selling the Cloud🎧 Listen now and follow Selling the Cloud for more GTM insights from leaders who’ve done the work. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Jamie Wilkinson, CEO of Smart4Cloud.ai, joins Mark Petruzzi and KK Anderson to explore how the best revenue organizations combine technical talent and sales leadership to create scalable, high-impact GTM engines. With 25 years of experience in both technical talent strategy and revenue organization design, Jamie breaks down how CROs and CEOs can avoid siloed growth models by integrating sales and technical infrastructure, especially in today’s AI-powered ecosystem. What You’ll Learn:Tech Talent as Revenue Infrastructure: Why roles like solution architects, SEs, and customer-facing engineers are now critical for sales success, not just delivery.Overcoming Tool Sprawl: How to focus less on “more tools” and more on extracting real value from your existing stack.Culture > Tech: Why a strong leadership culture still outperforms even the best tech when it comes to execution.The Visibility Gap: How AI platforms like Collective[i] help sales orgs see what’s really happening so they can coach, forecast, and prioritize smarter.How to Hire for AI-Era Sales: What today’s technical-hybrid sales roles look like, and how to recruit for adaptability, not just hard skills.Key Topics:Sales leadership architectureCustomer-facing technical roles in modern GTMStrategic use of AI tools in sales orgsAligning technical capabilities with deal velocityWhy forecasting is broken—and how to fix itThe difference between productivity KPIs vs. outcome KPIsRevenue visibility and operational clarityLeadership lessons from elite team sportsGuest Spotlight: Jamie Wilkinson Jamie Wilkinson is the founder and CEO of Smart4Cloud.ai, where he helps revenue leaders architect both technical and sales teams to drive market advantage. With a background in elite sales recruiting, technical hiring, and growth strategy, Jamie brings a unique lens to what it takes to scale high-performance organizations in the AI era. 🎧 Listen now and follow Selling the Cloud for practical GTM strategies and sharp conversations at the edge of sales, leadership, and growth. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Stephen Messer, co-founder of Collective[i] and LinkShare, shares a bold and timely vision for the future of sales—one that trades CRM inefficiencies, seller churn, and impersonal cadences for AI-powered intelligence, real buyer relationships, and a return to value-based growth. Stephen unpacks how Collective[i] is building the world’s first economic foundation model for B2B sales—a neural network that learns from billions in live market signals and transforms the way companies forecast, prioritize, and engage. If you’re leading a revenue team, this episode will challenge how you think about data, your CRM, and the very structure of your go-to-market engine. What You’ll Learn:The Real Cost of Today’s Sales Stack: Why CRM-driven workflows have created inefficiency, seller burnout, and buyer distrust.How Collective[i] Works: The power of neural networks that learn from shared, anonymized go-to-market activity—while keeping client data private and secure.Cruelty in Sales (and How to Fix It): A raw and honest take on how modern sales workflows punish reps and buyers—and how AI can fix it.The End of Data Entry: How Collective[i] automates pipeline visibility and eliminates the need for reps to “feed the system.”The Rise of Relationship-Centric Growth: Why trust, storytelling, and insight—not spam—will win in the next generation of GTM.Key Topics:What’s wrong with current sales tech (and why it’s unsustainable)How Collective[i] trains its neural net to understand real buying behaviorThe shift from CRM-driven sales to AI-first revenue intelligence“Lifeguards” and the shadow sellers that make or break dealsWhy buyer relationships have eroded—and how to rebuild themThe moral case for better GTM designReal examples of AI uncovering hidden pipeline riskWhy average sellers will become exceptional (or obsolete) with AIGuest Spotlight: Stephen Messer Stephen is the Co-Founder of Collective[i], a next-gen AI platform reinventing how companies forecast, collaborate, and close. He’s also known for co-founding LinkShare, the affiliate marketing pioneer acquired by Rakuten for $425M. A seasoned entrepreneur and thought leader, Stephen now leads Collective[i] in building the world’s first neural network for B2B sales. Resources & Mentions:Collective[i] – WebsiteCI Forecast: Collective[i]’s weekly go-to-market leadership eventBook mentioned: Predictable Revenue (and its long-term impact on sales culture)Topics discussed: AI-powered forecasting, seller efficiency, CRM alternatives, cadence fatigue, relationship rebuilding, data trust modelsListen now and follow Selling the Cloud for more unfiltered GTM insights from the leaders shaping the future of sales. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In Part 2 of this Selling the Cloud conversation, Josh Payne dives deeper into the future of AI-first growth teams, and how CoFrame is helping B2B orgs replace legacy handoffs and static workflows with continuously learning, automated systems. Josh shares how teams are deploying AI to automate experimentation, generate code, and even shape strategy in real time. He outlines what it takes to build with AI in production (not just in prompts), how roles like “growth engineer” are evolving, and why building competitive advantage in 2025 means more than just adding ChatGPT to your stack. What You’ll Learn:How AI Is Reshaping Growth Roles: Why marketers are evolving into orchestrators, engineers, and agents of optimization.Beyond Prompting—Toward Infrastructure: How CoFrame builds stable, repeatable workflows with AI that can learn, adapt, and improve continuously.Real-World Agent Use Cases: From UI code generation to multivariate testing and funnel orchestration, Josh shares how real AI agents are driving results.Why Speed > Strategy (Sometimes): Why fast learning cycles and live tests can outperform static GTM plans.How to Start Now: Advice for teams getting started with AI-based systems—without needing a research lab.Key Topics:AI in modern GTM orgsCode agents vs. code generationAutomating testing, design, and targetingThe rise of “quant growth” as a functionBreaking down silos with intelligent workflowsWhen to trust AI—and when not toCoFrame’s real-world implementation storiesGTM roles of the future: orchestrators vs. operatorsGuest Spotlight: Josh Payne Josh Payne is CEO of CoFrame and a leading voice at the intersection of AI, UX, and growth strategy. A repeat founder and AI researcher, he previously created GPT-Migrate and led growth products at top SaaS and fintech companies. His mission: make the web feel intelligent again. Resources & Mentions:Website: CoFrameConcepts: AI agents, orchestration layers, living interfaces, growth stacksTech Stack Mentions: GPT-4, Claude, OpenAI fine-tuning, VWO, Retool 🎧 Listen now and follow Selling the Cloud for more GTM conversations on scaling with AI, orchestrating growth, and building what’s next. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Josh Payne—Founder & CEO of CoFrame and creator of GPT-Migrate—joins Mark Petruzzi and KK Anderson to explore how AI agents and continuously optimizing websites are changing the future of digital growth. Josh shares how CoFrame is helping mid-market and enterprise companies drive 30%+ increases in conversion by building adaptive, AI-powered interfaces that test, learn, and optimize in real time. He also unpacks how his team partnered with OpenAI to create a state-of-the-art UI code generation model—and what this signals about the future of growth marketing. Whether you’re a CMO, growth lead, or founder looking to build durable competitive advantage through AI, this episode will shift your mindset and your roadmap. What You’ll Learn:From Static to Living Interfaces: Why websites are broken—and how AI agents can continuously optimize them based on real-time data and buyer behavior.The End of Manual A/B Testing: How Josh’s team automates experimentation at scale to unlock compound conversion lifts without traditional resource bottlenecks.Inside the OpenAI Partnership: How CoFrame trained a UI-specific code generation model that understands brand, layout, and style—then deployed it at scale.Building Competitive Advantage with AI: Why businesses that embrace continuous optimization today will outpace those stuck in manual, quarterly workflows.Designing the Future Growth Stack: How AI agents, data orchestration, and strategy automation will transform marketing roles and unlock new GTM velocity.Key Topics:Living interfaces vs. static websitesAI code generation for brand-consistent designScaling experimentation with AI agentsThe future of CRO: conversion rate optimizationAI in paid media, lifecycle marketing, and SEOStrategy design vs. manual executionHow to evaluate AI models like Claude, Gemini, GPT-4Building “quant growth” systems for marketingWhy the next big AI use case is growth engineeringGuest Spotlight: Josh Payne Josh is the CEO of CoFrame and a repeat founder with deep roots in AI. He previously co-founded Autograph (a $2B+ unicorn), created GPT-Migrate, and authored over 20 patents and AI research papers. At CoFrame, he’s pioneering AI-first digital experiences that adapt to users in real time. Resources & Mentions:CoFrame: https://coframe.comArticle: The New Science of Growth Marketing – EveryTech: GPT-4 Vision, Claude, MoonDream, OpenAI fine-tuningTools Mentioned: Optimizely, Adobe Target, VWO, AmplitudeTopic: Quant growth, UI code generation, AI agents🎧 Listen now and follow Selling the Cloud for cutting-edge conversations with the builders, strategists, and GTM leaders shaping the future of sales, growth, and AI. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Mike Milburn—former Chief Customer Officer at Salesforce and founding team member of Service Cloud—joins Mark Petruzzi and KK Anderson for a masterclass in aligning product and sales teams around a shared go-to-market mission. Drawing from his 15+ years at Salesforce, Mike shares hard-won frameworks for building product roadmaps that sales can actually sell, developing trust between CROs and CPOs, and scaling alignment across growth stages. This is a blueprint for leaders who want revenue-generating product strategy—not just internal harmony. What You’ll Learn:The Product–Sales Friction Point: How most teams mismanage this relationship and how to turn it into a revenue advantage.Revenue-Calorie Framework: Why Salesforce prioritized roadmap decisions by “calories” and how to balance innovation vs. renewals.V2MOM as a GTM Operating System: What the V2MOM framework taught Mike about prioritization, transparency, and shared accountability.From Anecdotes to Data: How to structure sales feedback into decision-ready inputs for product teams.Product + Sales = One Team: What world-class collaboration looks like—when sales leaders evangelize the roadmap and product leaders join customer conversations.Key Topics:CRO and CPO relationship-building strategiesTranslating sales objections into roadmap investmentThe role of customer success in roadmap prioritizationQuantifying “deal blockers” to influence productRunning effective board conversations around productHow “True to the Core” made Salesforce a customer-led companyScaling product-sales collaboration from startup to enterpriseGuest Spotlight: Mike Milburn Mike Milburn is the former Chief Customer Officer at Salesforce and was part of the founding team of Service Cloud. Today, he serves as an advisor to multiple SaaS companies. His career centers on building GTM systems where product, sales, and customer success function as one growth engine. Resources & Mentions:Framework: V2MOM – Vision, Values, Methods, Obstacles, MetricsSalesforce Event: “True to the Core” session at DreamforceRecommended Book: Behind the Cloud by Marc BenioffOther Concepts: Revenue-calorie model, sales telemetry, deal blocker mapping 🎧 Listen now and follow Selling the Cloud for more insights from GTM leaders building high-growth, cross-functional teams. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Mike Milburn—former Chief Customer Officer at Salesforce and founding team member of Service Cloud—joins Mark Petruzzi and KK Anderson for a masterclass in aligning product and sales teams around a shared go-to-market mission. Drawing from his 15+ years at Salesforce, Mike shares hard-won frameworks for building product roadmaps that sales can actually sell, developing trust between CROs and CPOs, and scaling alignment across growth stages. This is a blueprint for leaders who want revenue-generating product strategy—not just internal harmony. What You’ll Learn:The Product–Sales Friction Point: How most teams mismanage this relationship and how to turn it into a revenue advantage.Revenue-Calorie Framework: Why Salesforce prioritized roadmap decisions by “calories” and how to balance innovation vs. renewals.V2MOM as a GTM Operating System: What the V2MOM framework taught Mike about prioritization, transparency, and shared accountability.From Anecdotes to Data: How to structure sales feedback into decision-ready inputs for product teams.Product + Sales = One Team: What world-class collaboration looks like—when sales leaders evangelize the roadmap and product leaders join customer conversations.Key Topics:CRO and CPO relationship-building strategiesTranslating sales objections into roadmap investmentThe role of customer success in roadmap prioritizationQuantifying “deal blockers” to influence productRunning effective board conversations around productHow “True to the Core” made Salesforce a customer-led companyScaling product-sales collaboration from startup to enterpriseGuest Spotlight: Mike Milburn Mike Milburn is the former Chief Customer Officer at Salesforce and was part of the founding team of Service Cloud. Today, he serves as an advisor to multiple SaaS companies. His career centers on building GTM systems where product, sales, and customer success function as one growth engine. Resources & Mentions:Framework: V2MOM – Vision, Values, Methods, Obstacles, MetricsSalesforce Event: “True to the Core” session at DreamforceRecommended Book: Behind the Cloud by Marc BenioffOther Concepts: Revenue-calorie model, sales telemetry, deal blocker mapping🎧 Listen now and follow Selling the Cloud for more insights from GTM leaders building high-growth, cross-functional teams. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This special episode kicks off our Mastering Sales with AI series with a candid, high-impact discussion on how revenue leaders can move beyond AI buzzwords and actually apply intelligent selling strategies—especially in volatile markets. Stephen Messer and Paul Melchiorre join Mark Petruzzi to break down the hard truths about what makes AI work in real sales orgs: leadership alignment, data readiness, and daily execution. This is your first step toward modern, adaptive selling—driven by signal, not guesswork. What You’ll Learn:Execution Beats Ambition: Why success with AI doesn’t start with big vision decks—but with specific, high-impact use cases.Your CRM Can’t Keep Up: Why traditional tools break in volatile markets, and how neural net AI models adjust in real time.Forecasting Needs a Reboot: How daily deal signals—red, yellow, green—are replacing “gut feel” and weekly sales meetings.Buyer-Centric Strategy: Why studying sellers won’t help you predict revenue—but studying buyers will.Leading with Insight: How top CROs gain board trust through data, not opinions.Key Topics:Moving from AI theory to operational realityFixing broken forecasting processesLeveraging volatility as a growth advantageRedefining enablement with signal-based coachingWhy AI is a co-pilot, not a replacementHow to scale insights across sellers, teams, and time zones Event Recap – Top Takeaways:Start small, win big: Tie AI to real revenue use cases.Clean data wins: No insights without data discipline.AI empowers, not replaces: Give time back to sellers, and sharpen execution.Execution > tools: Adoption follows alignment.🎧 Listen now and follow Selling the Cloud for more episodes in our Mastering Sales with AI series. New sessions coming soon. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In Part 2 of this Selling the Cloud conversation, Stephen Messer, Co-Founder of Collective[i], continues to challenge the status quo of sales technology and leadership—this time focusing on how GTM teams can embrace AI, real-time data, and agile principles to navigate today’s complex buying environments. Stephen and the hosts explore what’s broken in forecasting, why reactive CRM systems create risk, and how the modern seller’s mindset needs to evolve in a world where speed, adaptability, and intelligence win. What You’ll Learn:The Rise of Agile Selling: Why sales leaders need to build systems that adapt in real time—not ones that just report what already happened.AI-Enhanced Forecasting: How predictive intelligence is helping teams eliminate bias and plan more accurately.Why CRM Alone Is a Liability: A deep dive into why legacy sales systems fail in fast-moving markets.How to Spot Buying Signals Earlier: What modern sales orgs are doing to move faster and respond with precision.Changing the Sales Culture: Why the future of sales leadership depends on embracing new data models and tech-forward practices.Key Topics:Limitations of CRM forecastingIntegrating AI for signal-based sellingBuyer journey complexity and data latencyBuilding an agile, responsive GTM motionReal-time revenue intelligence toolsLeadership shifts for the AI-enabled seller Guest Spotlight: Stephen Messer Stephen is Co-Founder and Vice Chairman of Collective[i], a revenue intelligence platform leveraging AI to enable agile sales execution. He’s a serial entrepreneur with a passion for reshaping how sales teams operate in dynamic, data-rich environments. Resources & Mentions:Company: Collective[i]Topics: Agile revenue strategy, AI forecasting, CRM alternativesSuggested Reading: The JOLT Effect, The Qualified Sales Leader, The Sales Acceleration Formula🎧 Listen now and follow Selling the Cloud for more episodes on modern GTM, enterprise sales, and AI-led transformation. Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

In this episode, Stephen Messer shares how he built LinkShare into a $500M company, the lessons learned from scaling, and his insights on venture building and long-term thinking.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Kristina Jaramillo, President of Personal ABM, shares how B2B revenue teams can fix flawed ABM programs by aligning Sales and Marketing, redefining their ICP, and focusing on personalized account experiences that drive real enterprise growth.

In this episode of Selling the Cloud, Kristina Jaramillo, President of Personal ABM, shares how revenue teams can rebuild ABM strategies around account relevance, strategic ICPs, and full-funnel alignment to win and expand enterprise deals.