Is the "traditional" accounting firm still a viable model in 2025 and beyond? And what does its evolution mean for the entire Accounting Tech ecosystem?
This week, we're joined by Luke Farren, founder of The Modern Firm and a consultant who helps accounting practices navigate their own Digital Transformation. We explore the massive shift from people-heavy practices to lean, tech-first firms that operate more like SaaS businesses themselves.
We also debate the future of the profession, from data warehouses and AI in Accounting to whether AI bots create an "opportunity loss" by replacing the human touch.
Join us for a deep dive into the other side of the coin—understanding the accountant's world is the key to solving your own activation puzzle.
Follow Luke: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lukefarren/
The Modern Firm: https://modernfirm.co.uk/
Follow Counting on Change:
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLF2J1WlIWLMywubuNZt2RFWZECtkF4cVi&si=FzQ37NC7AyqwurGW
https://www.linkedin.com/in/leighstallard/
Episode Chapters:
00:00 Coming Up...
00:53 Guest Introduction: Luke Farren's Journey (From in-practice to building a tech-first firm, getting acquired, and founding The Modern Firm).
02:28 The Evolution of Accounting Firms (The big idea: why firms are starting to operate and structure themselves more like SaaS businesses).
03:57 Impact of Technology on Accounting Practices (How tech is changing behaviour and why the pace of change is the real barrier, not the appetite for it).
05:54 Challenges and Opportunities for Firms (The #1 challenge for firms: well-structured data. Why it's a "garbage in, garbage out" problem for your tech).
09:11 Future Scenarios and Big Tech in Accounting *(Debating the future: will firms become "data warehouses"? Could Google or Amazon enter the accounting space?) * 14:14 AI and Automation in Accounting (The rise of AI agents for client queries and the "opportunity loss" of removing human interaction).
20:05 The Role of Accountants in a Tech-Driven World (Reframing automation: does it free up accountants to be proactive rather than reactive?)
22:40 Conclusion and Contact Information
Your activation rates are stalling and you're fighting churn. Before you blame the product, have you asked if your Customer Success team truly understands your customer's world?
What's the difference between a CSM who just manages an account and one who drives deep adoption and makes your product indispensable?
In this episode of Counting on Change, I talk to someone who has sat on both sides of the table: Katie Hawking, Head of Customer Success at Dext and a former accountant of 13 years. Katie shares an insider's perspective on building a world-class CS function that's built on deep industry empathy and a proactive approach to partner success.
✅ In this episode, we define what 'good' CSM looks like, including:
Why your CSMs must train the client's middle managers to prevent project failure and churn.
The critical difference between selling "practice benefits" and "client benefits"—and why your team must know it.
The leading indicators of churn (like low feature adoption) and how to spot them in the first 90 days.
A proven "workflow mapping" framework to unstick a stalled implementation and accelerate time-to-value.
How to build a scalable, one-to-many CS motion with webinars and on-demand content when one-to-one isn't possible.
This one’s especially useful for:
👉 SaaS Founders & CEOs defining their post-sale strategy to drive retention.
👉 GTM & Customer Success Leaders building and scaling effective, proactive teams.
👉 Onboarding & Implementation Specialists looking for new frameworks to increase activation.
👉 Sales Leaders who want to understand the customer journey post-sale to reduce churn.
👉Accountants and bookkeepers who aren't sure what to expect from post-sale support.
🔗 Connect with Katie: LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/katie-hawking-fmaat-baa6a071/
🔔 Subscribe for weekly episodes on SaaS onboarding, tech strategy, and client success.
Timestamps:
00:00 Coming Up
01:34 From Accountant to Head of CS: An Insider's Perspective
02:54 Why Your Customers Really Struggle with New Tech
04:52 The 'Middle Manager' Blind Spot in Your Onboarding Process
06:31 Defining 'Good' CSM: Key Implementation Strategies
10:44 Leading Indicators of Churn (And How to Track Them)
13:24 The Workflow Mapping Framework to Unstick Customers
18:42 Building a Scalable CS Motion (Even Without a Big Team)
23:16 Understanding the 'Why' Behind Customer Resistance to Change
25:31 How to Connect with Katie
If your SaaS or tech implementation feels broken, it might not be the tools – maybe it’s your processes.In this episode of Counting on Change, I’m joined by Bethanie Hawkins – digital transformation consultant and accounting tech ninja – to unpack why so many firms fail at change initiatives, and what to do differently.✅ We explore: • Why workflow mapping is your step zero in digital transformation • Common red flags in accountants processes • How to get internal buy-in (without the usual drama) • When *not* to replace your systems • The real cost of untrained staff and verbal processesThis one’s especially useful for:👉 Accountants and bookkeepers who're trying to do new and interesting things in their practices👉 Customer success and onboarding leaders looking to reduce time-to-value👉 Sales leaders who want to empathise with post-sale tech implementation👉 Anyone trying to drive real change in SaaS without chasing shiny objects🔗 Connect with Bethanie: LinkedIn🔔 Subscribe for weekly episodes on SaaS onboarding, tech strategy, and client success.00:00 Coming Up01:27 Bethany Hawkins: Background and Experience02:18 Key Characteristics of Successful Firms03:15 The Role of a Change Champion05:03 Planning and Logistics of Change06:04 The Value of Process Mapping08:44 Common Pitfalls and Solutions15:22 Managing Change Effectively17:18 Identifying Red Flags and Initial Steps19:45 Challenges in Large Firms23:23 Building a Strong Business Case25:35 Conclusion and Final Thoughts
Could Dubai leapfrog the UK when it comes to B2B SaaS tech adoption in accounting? In this episode, we dive into what’s really happening on the ground in the UAE, with a focus on accounting firms, cloud migration, AI-driven automation and the evolving role of vendors.We’re joined by Ayman Kaouri—former Xero EMEA strategy lead and now driving change at Scope—who shares insights on the rise of Dubai as a hotspot for accounting SaaS, how local legislation like VAT, corporate tax and upcoming e-invoicing is pushing tech forward, and what UK firms can learn (or fear?) from the UAE’s breakneck pace.💡 Topics we cover: • B2B SaaS tech adoption: UK vs UAE • Dubai’s accounting tech scene post-VAT & corporate tax • AI, automation and the role of change agents in SaaS adoption • How tech conferences (or lack of them) impact awareness • Why some Dubai firms may soon compete in the UK • Vendor blind spots and opportunities in the Middle East00:00 Ayman Kaouri - The Dubai Crossover01:55 Personal Journey in the Accounting Tech Space03:48 Overcoming Resistance to Change in Accounting06:54 Dubai vs. UK: Tech Adoption in Accounting11:15 The Role of AI and Emerging Technologies16:29 The Future of Accounting Tech in Dubai29:42 Conclusion and Final Thoughts🎙️ Perfect for:SaaS vendors, accountants, tech consultants, and anyone watching the global shift in B2B accounting tech.🔗 Learn more about Scope and Accounting Refiguredhttps://scopecloudsolutions.com/https://refigured.tech/📬 Connect with Ayman on LinkedIn – he’s open to chathttps://www.linkedin.com/in/ayman-kaouri/This podcast is produced and edited by Nomad Videohttps://nomadvideo.co.uk/#saas #accountingtech #dubaitech #b2bsaas #uae #cloudaccounting #techadoption #fintech #xero #dext #accountingtransformation
Customer Success & Digital Transformation in Accounting
What does good look like when it comes to implementing SaaS tools in an accounting firm? This week, I’m joined by Aleisha Hales (ex-Xero, now at Silverfin) to talk about the messy, human reality of accounting tech success – and how vendors and firms can both do better.
We dig into:
– Why enablement matters in SaaS customer success
– The red flags of self-implementation gone wrong
– How accountants can push back and ask more from vendors
– What the chain of change looks like in practice
– And how to build a culture that’s actually ready for digital transformation
If you’re in an accounting practice wrestling with change – or a SaaS vendor selling into the space – this one’s essential listening.
00:00 Coming Up
00:46 Customer Success in Digital Transformation
01:29 Aleisha Hales' Professional Background
02:49 Navigating Change Management in Accounting
05:40 Common Pitfalls in Software Implementation
09:22 Balancing Vendor and Firm Responsibilities
14:44 Strategies for Effective Change Management
21:27 The Chain of Change in Sales
22:03 Non-Negotiables for Industry Standards
22:30 Understanding Customer Success
24:19 Balancing Sales Aggression and Customer Needs
25:03 The Importance of Intentional Projects
25:51 Risk and Change in the Accounting Industry
28:31 Customising Business Reviews
31:12 Continuous Customer-Vendor Relationship
37:27 Final Thoughts and Fun Questions
🎧 Subscribe for more on accountant digital transformation, SaaS customer success, and what it takes to get accounting tech projects over the line.
Turning a challenge into a service line - how accountancy firms can take their digital transformation lessons and turn them into new service lines - and why this might be more crucial than you think.Ryan Pearcy shares his journey from a small firm to leading digital transformation teams, discussing the major hurdles firms face, the importance of AI, and the shift from compliance to assurance. The conversation covers the need for a strategic approach, the critical role of communities and collaboration, and the intrinsic link between internal and external digital initiatives. Learn what steps firms can take to stay ahead and why digital transformation is set to become the cornerstone of future success in accounting.00:00 Introduction to Digital Transformation00:02 Challenges in Implementing AI and Digital Transformation00:40 The Evolution of Compliance in Accounting00:58 Career Journey and Building Digital Transformation Departments03:47 The Art of Digital Transformation05:06 Balancing Risk and Growth in Digital Services07:49 The Future of AI in Accounting12:33 Steps for Firms to Embrace Digital Transformation20:38 The Importance of Collaboration and Niching24:27 Practical Steps to Start Digital Transformation26:15 Conclusion and Final Thoughts
In this captivating episode, Billie Mcloughlin, an ACCA qualified accountant, looks into the explosive growth of artificial intelligence and its transformative impact on the accounting profession.
With 16 years of experience, Billie shares insights on how AI models are evolving at unprecedented rates, predicting that 90% of Google's code will be written by AI within the next year. She discusses the current state and future implications of AI in professional services, revealing how firms can stay ahead of the curve and mitigate potential threats.
Billie also emphasises the importance of a mindset shift and intentional action to harness AI's benefits effectively. Tune in to discover practical advice, the challenges and opportunities AI presents, and why missing the AI train now could leave you stranded.
00:00 Introduction to the AI Revolution
00:59 Meet Billie McLaughlin
01:41 The Rise of AI in Accounting
03:52 AI's Impact on Work Hours and Job Security
05:32 Training and Adapting to AI
06:33 The Future of Compliance and Advisory Services
08:36 Getting Ahead with AI: Practical Steps
11:52 The Rapid Evolution of AI
15:58 Cutting-Edge AI Applications in Firms
19:58 The Importance of Starting Early with AI
22:46 Career Opportunities and Specialisation in AI
27:16 Final Thoughts and Connecting with Billie
Counting on Change is the place to learn about how to embrace change and digital transformation in the accounting tech space.
This episode I'm speaking to Andy Collings, who has a strong background in getting tech into large and enterprise-level practices and businesses, and is currently driving rapid growth at Active Workpapers, where he's trying to disrupt one of the few very few processes in accounting firms that has largely remain untouched over the last three decades.
Join us as Stephen shares his experiences and lessons (sometimes painful ones) of dealing with Vendors.
Stephen and his firm Valued Accountancy are bone-fide early adopters - with a ‘fastest growing partner’ award at Xero’s first UK Xerocon in 2012 as proof. They’ve dealt with all manner of vendors and account managers from the best in the business to… well, not the best.
We discuss the importance of resisting that tempting urge to mass-apply solutions and how crucial clear communication with your team and vendors is.
00:00 Coming Up…
01:03 This week - Stephen Paul
02:58 Defining a vision for the firm
05:53 Getting the team behind the vision
09:00 Red flags with Vendors
13:43 Trust and honesty
19:43 How to manage your account manager
25:03 Being upfront with vendors
29:03 Top advice to young account managers
34:19 Who would play you in a film?
This episode - The Podfather Part 2.
Phil Hobden returns to share what's changed (and what hasn't) in the accounting tech space in the last 18 months.
Crucially, we discuss who will helped - and who will be hindered - by the coming wave of AI tools.
Should you be pushing on with AI tools, or would you be better served by working on your strategy or foundational tech?
Listen in to find out!
This podcast is powered by Nomad Video.
This episode - Darren Glanville
Darren was one of the very first people to start selling saas accounting software to clients. Since then he’s influenced a generation of tech-focused accounting and bookkeeping firms, countless account managers and has led successful sales teams in a number of roles.
Darren’s advice will be invaluable to saas account mangers, sales leaders - but also to accounting firms who engage with account managers. His advice will help set the bar for what should be expected from an account manager.
We cover:
🔸 Changes in over a decade of saas implementation
🔸 How to be a great account manager
🔸 Lessons that firms can learn
🔸 Selling beyond goods and services
As Head of Sales at Xero UK, Ian Phillips has direct and indirect access to thousands of accounting and bookkeeping firms, so he knows a thing or two about tech adoption.
Ian is an incredibly thoughtful and observant guy, who absorbs data, combines it with his own anecdotal experience and grounded common sense - and churns out incredible insights.
So who better to sit down and discuss the hard data on UK accounting tech adoption.
We discuss:
🔸 Xero’s 2023 accounting and bookkeeping industry insights report
🔸 How mid and large firms are out-performing small and micro firms on adoption
🔸 Insights that challenge our understanding of tech adoption - built on a combined 20+ years experience in accounting tech
🔸 The experience that new entrants to the accounting profession are (sometimes) getting
Find Ian here:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/ian-phillips-303288b/
Find the report here:
This episode - Phil Hobden.Phil is highly regarded in the accounting tech space - having held influential roles at a number of companies - including Futrli, Capitalise and Wolters Kluwer.He's also a regular speaker at industry events, a podcaster and co-founder of a vendor community.We talk how firms challenges to adopt tech sometimes lie outside of the firms walls. We cover:🔸 Being honest about what vendors are really after🔸 What accountants and bookkeepers should look for in a vendor🔸 Solving problems not symptoms🔸 3 pillars of great partnership
This episode - Heather Elkington
Strong, effective leadership is pivotal to effective change, so we discussed some of the fundamental tactics to:
🔸 Jolt the business out of inaction
🔸 Get the team to step up take initiative
🔸 Getting out of your own way
And lots more.
Heather is quickly emerging as a go-to expert on leadership in the accounting tech space - so this episode is packed full of actionable insights to help you get your team and business moving in the direction you want it to go.
How to find Heather:
inthemakingleadership.substack.com
https://www.linkedin.com/in/heather-elkington/
https://www.tiktok.com/@leadershipheather
https://www.instagram.com/leadershipheather/
This episode - Rishi Ruparelia.
Rishi Ruparelia - possibly the UK's most loved account manager - discusses his view on these things in the return of Counting on Change - plus:
🔸 Lifting the curtain on vendors' priorities
🔸 Lessons learn from successful firms
🔸 Just offer the blue pill? Or blue, green, pink and... earthy green.
This episode - Ket Patel.
Ket Patel is a change manager with a vast amount of experience.
We talk about the change management lessons that accountants can learn, to make their digital transformation efforts run more smoothly.
We look at: - Getting change started in your organisation - Does your project need change management? - Whether line managers should push back more Ket has spend more than 12 years leading change and transformation within the Finance, Tech and Consulting Industries. He’s a volunteer and former co-lead of the Change Management Institute’s UK Chapter and some of Ket’s clients include EY, The Home Office, International Coaching Federation and Cecil Housing Trust.
This episode - Tony Stevenson
"We wanted a Tech Stack, but we ended up with a Tech Splat"
Tony Stevenson FCA is a man who knows his way around the sharp end of tech adoption in accounting firms...
Having worked with over 1,000 firms, Tony has a *boatload* of experience, lessons and more than one or two funny stories to share.
It was great to catch up with him to learn: - what mistakes firms are making - what make a great cloud champion and - what's changed in the years leading up to his current role as Digital Enablement Manager at FreeAgent There's amazing value here for firms who're struggling their way through #digitaltransformation.
This episode - Emily Deakin
The Cloud Champion is a critical role in Digital Transformation, but the question is "What Makes a Great Cloud Champion?" 🧠 What the best personality type is for a Cloud Champion? ✨ How to develop and offer incredible client experiences? 👩🏻🏫 How to engage the rest of the team for effective training? Recently I caught up with Emily Deakin who is the #Cloud Accounts Specialist at Moore Growth Accountants to go over some of these themes.
Emily also shared some great advice for Cloud Champions OR Practice leaders looking to hire for a #CloudChampion role.
