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Complicating The Narrative
Salma Abdalla
3 episodes
16 hours ago
In this podcast, hosted by Dr. Salma Abdalla—Assistant Professor and Director of the Healthier Futures Lab at Washington University in St. Louis—we provide rigorous, evidence-based analysis of complex population health challenges. In a time of social, economic, and political upheaval—marked by eroding public trust, polarized narratives, and growing uncertainty—this podcast aims to challenge oversimplified narratives about the forces that shape the health of populations. Salma engages guests from across disciplines in rigorous, evidence-based conversations that challenge conventional wisdom. The conversations sometimes pose uncomfortable questions, seek nuanced perspectives, and question not just what we think, but how we arrive at our conclusions in public health. We explore the inherent complexities, real-world tradeoffs, and unintended consequences of public health interventions. Our goal is to empower listeners with nuanced understanding, helping them navigate these multifaceted issues in an informed and balanced way. The podcast is supported by the Washington University School of Public Health—https://schoolofpublichealth.washu.edu—and the Frick Initiative. Host: Dr. Salma Abdalla Editors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary Linhares Music: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/ Contact us at: s.abdalla@wustl.edu
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In this podcast, hosted by Dr. Salma Abdalla—Assistant Professor and Director of the Healthier Futures Lab at Washington University in St. Louis—we provide rigorous, evidence-based analysis of complex population health challenges. In a time of social, economic, and political upheaval—marked by eroding public trust, polarized narratives, and growing uncertainty—this podcast aims to challenge oversimplified narratives about the forces that shape the health of populations. Salma engages guests from across disciplines in rigorous, evidence-based conversations that challenge conventional wisdom. The conversations sometimes pose uncomfortable questions, seek nuanced perspectives, and question not just what we think, but how we arrive at our conclusions in public health. We explore the inherent complexities, real-world tradeoffs, and unintended consequences of public health interventions. Our goal is to empower listeners with nuanced understanding, helping them navigate these multifaceted issues in an informed and balanced way. The podcast is supported by the Washington University School of Public Health—https://schoolofpublichealth.washu.edu—and the Frick Initiative. Host: Dr. Salma Abdalla Editors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary Linhares Music: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/ Contact us at: s.abdalla@wustl.edu
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Science
Episodes (3/3)
Complicating The Narrative
Health diplomacy in an evolving global health landscape with Dr Anders Nördstrom
In this deeply challenging moment for global health and international relations, how do we navigate the public health challenges that transcend borders? Dr. Anders Nördstrom, program director of the Health Diplomacy Initiative at the Karolinska Institutet and the Stockholm School of Economics has unique experience in working at the intersection of health, politics, economics, and international relations. He was the Interim Executive Director for the Global Fund to Fight AIDS, Tuberculosis and Malaria, acting Director of the World Health Organization, first ambassador for global health for Sweden, and head of the Secretariat for the Independent Panel for Pandemic Preparedness and Response Salma and Anders discuss health diplomacy and global health leadership, highlighting the need for partnerships and interdisciplinary collaboration. They explore the current global landscape and reflect on the progress that has been made since the establishment of the Millennium Development Goals. Progress has been made, though not at the pace we had hoped for. The conversation also explores three critical priorities: policies that promote healthier rather than solely longer lives, approaches that deliver co-benefits for climate and health, and the evolution needed in multilateral organizations across the global health landscape. This episode invites listeners to think like a global health diplomat, examining why optimism is justified despite current challenges and what opportunities exist in moments of crisis. In this moment of change, what role could you play in building the health partnerships your community needs for future challenges?   Useful resources Health Diplomacy Initiative: https://globalhealthdiplomacy.se  The Independent Panel for Pandemic Preparedness and Response: https://theindependentpanel.org/ Wong BLH, Nordström A, Piot P, Clark H; Global Health Diplomacy Partners. From polycrisis to metacrisis: harnessing windows of opportunity for renewed political leadership in global health diplomacy. BMJ Glob Health. 2024 Apr 18;9(4):e015340. doi: 10.1136/bmjgh-2024-015340. PMID: 38637121; PMCID: PMC11029238.   Host: Dr. Salma AbdallaEditors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary LinharesMarketing: Kinkini BhaduriMusic: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/
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16 hours ago
59 minutes 33 seconds

Complicating The Narrative
Manufacturing Doubt: the commercial determinants of health with Dr Nason Maani
How do powerful industries shape what we believe about health risks—and what we don't? Dr. Nason Maani, Senior Lecturer (Associate Professor) in Inequalities and Global Health Policy at the University of Edinburgh, has spent years uncovering how commercial interests influence public health understanding. Salma and Nason tackle the commercial determinants of health framework, moving beyond the typical focus on individual choices to examine the systems that shape those choices. They dig into Nason's "Manufacturing Doubt" paper, which investigated how industries weaponize uncertainty against public health evidence—using “alternative causation” arguments. The conversation explores the methodological challenges of researching corporate actors and the need to translate evidence about commercial influence into effective policy action. This episode challenges listeners to consider whether our focus on individual behavior change might be missing the bigger picture of who benefits from keeping populations unhealthy. How have you seen commercial interests shape health discussions in your field?   Useful resources Maani N, Van Schalkwyk MCI, Filippidis FT, Knai C, Petticrew M. Manufacturing doubt: Assessing the effects of independent vs industry-sponsored messaging about the harms of fossil fuels, smoking, alcohol, and sugar sweetened beverages. SSM - Population Health. 2022;17:101009. doi:1016/j.ssmph.2021.101009 Maani N, Petticrew M, Galea S, eds. The Commercial Determinants of Health. Oxford University Press; 2022. https://global.oup.com/academic/product/the-commercial-determinants-of-health-9780197578759?cc=us&lang=en& Money, Power, Health with Nason Maani (podcast): https://anchor.fm/s/b50fce1c/podcast/rss https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/money-power-health-with-nason-maani/id1667592518 https://open.spotify.com/episode/0Aa2qRUtfM0eVUYNxF6Bvf Host: Dr. Salma AbdallaEditors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary LinharesMusic: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/
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2 weeks ago
1 hour 8 minutes 52 seconds

Complicating The Narrative
Rethinking Public Health with Dean Sandro Galea
As public health faces mounting challenges, what does meaningful progress actually look like? This inaugural episode features Sandro Galea, Margaret C. Ryan Dean and Eugene S. and Constance Kahn Distinguished Professor at Washington University's newly established School of Public Health. Salma and Dean Galea dive deep into his concept of "consequential epidemiology"—the idea that research should drive real-world change, not just academic publications. They explore the "Healthiest Goldfish" analogy and what it reveals about how we think about population health interventions. The conversation also tackles why this moment feels particularly significant for launching a new school of public health, and Dean Galea shares the one public health question that genuinely keeps him awake at night. This episode sets the stage for our series by examining not just what public health does, but what it should aspire to do differently. What assumptions about public health do you think need challenging? Useful resources: The Healthiest Goldfish:https://sandrogalea.substack.com Galea S. Well: What We Need to Talk about When We Talk about Health. Oxford University Press; 2019. Galea S. The Contagion next Time. Oxford University Press; 2022 WashU Public Health 4x4 Plan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRa1zpLXwCc&t=1s Host: Dr. Salma AbdallaEditors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary LinharesMusic: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/
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4 weeks ago
51 minutes 3 seconds

Complicating The Narrative
In this podcast, hosted by Dr. Salma Abdalla—Assistant Professor and Director of the Healthier Futures Lab at Washington University in St. Louis—we provide rigorous, evidence-based analysis of complex population health challenges. In a time of social, economic, and political upheaval—marked by eroding public trust, polarized narratives, and growing uncertainty—this podcast aims to challenge oversimplified narratives about the forces that shape the health of populations. Salma engages guests from across disciplines in rigorous, evidence-based conversations that challenge conventional wisdom. The conversations sometimes pose uncomfortable questions, seek nuanced perspectives, and question not just what we think, but how we arrive at our conclusions in public health. We explore the inherent complexities, real-world tradeoffs, and unintended consequences of public health interventions. Our goal is to empower listeners with nuanced understanding, helping them navigate these multifaceted issues in an informed and balanced way. The podcast is supported by the Washington University School of Public Health—https://schoolofpublichealth.washu.edu—and the Frick Initiative. Host: Dr. Salma Abdalla Editors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary Linhares Music: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/ Contact us at: s.abdalla@wustl.edu