In this podcast, hosted by Dr. Salma Abdalla—Assistant Professor and Director of the Healthier Futures Lab at Washington University in St. Louis—we provide rigorous, evidence-based analysis of complex population health challenges. In a time of social, economic, and political upheaval—marked by eroding public trust, polarized narratives, and growing uncertainty—this podcast aims to challenge oversimplified narratives about the forces that shape the health of populations.
Salma engages guests from across disciplines in rigorous, evidence-based conversations that challenge conventional wisdom. The conversations sometimes pose uncomfortable questions, seek nuanced perspectives, and question not just what we think, but how we arrive at our conclusions in public health.
We explore the inherent complexities, real-world tradeoffs, and unintended consequences of public health interventions. Our goal is to empower listeners with nuanced understanding, helping them navigate these multifaceted issues in an informed and balanced way.
The podcast is supported by the Washington University School of Public Health—https://schoolofpublichealth.washu.edu—and the Frick Initiative.
Host: Dr. Salma Abdalla
Editors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary Linhares
Music: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/
Contact us at: s.abdalla@wustl.edu
All content for Complicating The Narrative is the property of Salma Abdalla and is served directly from their servers
with no modification, redirects, or rehosting. The podcast is not affiliated with or endorsed by Podjoint in any way.
In this podcast, hosted by Dr. Salma Abdalla—Assistant Professor and Director of the Healthier Futures Lab at Washington University in St. Louis—we provide rigorous, evidence-based analysis of complex population health challenges. In a time of social, economic, and political upheaval—marked by eroding public trust, polarized narratives, and growing uncertainty—this podcast aims to challenge oversimplified narratives about the forces that shape the health of populations.
Salma engages guests from across disciplines in rigorous, evidence-based conversations that challenge conventional wisdom. The conversations sometimes pose uncomfortable questions, seek nuanced perspectives, and question not just what we think, but how we arrive at our conclusions in public health.
We explore the inherent complexities, real-world tradeoffs, and unintended consequences of public health interventions. Our goal is to empower listeners with nuanced understanding, helping them navigate these multifaceted issues in an informed and balanced way.
The podcast is supported by the Washington University School of Public Health—https://schoolofpublichealth.washu.edu—and the Frick Initiative.
Host: Dr. Salma Abdalla
Editors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary Linhares
Music: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/
Contact us at: s.abdalla@wustl.edu
Algorithms, attention, and trust: Rethinking health communication with Matthew Kreuter
Complicating The Narrative
1 hour 10 minutes
1 month ago
Algorithms, attention, and trust: Rethinking health communication with Matthew Kreuter
The techniques that make health messages more effective—personalization, customization, targeted delivery—are the same tools driving the spread of inaccurate health claims at scale. Dr. Matthew Kreuter, WashU’s Kahn Family Professor of Public Health and founding director of the Health Communication Research Laboratory, is an expert on effective and equity-oriented health communications and has been thinking about these issues for decades.
In this episode, Salma and Dr. Kreuter trace the evolution from pamphlet racks to algorithm feeds. They discuss why well-intentioned public health messaging can backfire and highlight the importance of listening. They explore why certain terms have become counterproductive, the costs of communicating false certainty, and why public health can’t message its way out of complex problems.
Tune in for a candid discussion about the double-edged nature of communication in the algorithm age, and why the future of health communication may depend less on what we say than on how well we listen.
Useful resources:
Kreuter MW, Farrell DW, Olevitch LR, Brennan LK. Tailoring Health Messages. 0 ed. Routledge; 2013. doi:4324/9781315045382
Johnson KJ, Weng O, Kinzer H, et al. iHeard STL: Development and first year findings from a local surveillance and rapid response system for addressing COVID-19 and other health misinformation. Dinga JN, ed. PLoS ONE. 2023;18(11):e0293288. doi:1371/journal.pone.0293288
Schneider T. Rich trove of data on social needs waits to be tapped. WashU Public Health. August 12, 2025. https://schoolofpublichealth.washu.edu/rich-trove-of-data-on-social-needs-waits-to-be-tapped/
Health Communication Research Laboratory. iHeard St. Louis. https://stl.iheard.org
Health Communication Research Laboratory. 211 counts. https://211counts.org/home/index
Williams D. What is misinformation, anyway? Conspicuous Cognition. December 1, 2024. https://substack.com/@conspicuouscognition/p-151889774
Host: Dr. Salma AbdallaEditors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary LinharesMarketing: Kinkini BhaduriMusic: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/
Complicating The Narrative
In this podcast, hosted by Dr. Salma Abdalla—Assistant Professor and Director of the Healthier Futures Lab at Washington University in St. Louis—we provide rigorous, evidence-based analysis of complex population health challenges. In a time of social, economic, and political upheaval—marked by eroding public trust, polarized narratives, and growing uncertainty—this podcast aims to challenge oversimplified narratives about the forces that shape the health of populations.
Salma engages guests from across disciplines in rigorous, evidence-based conversations that challenge conventional wisdom. The conversations sometimes pose uncomfortable questions, seek nuanced perspectives, and question not just what we think, but how we arrive at our conclusions in public health.
We explore the inherent complexities, real-world tradeoffs, and unintended consequences of public health interventions. Our goal is to empower listeners with nuanced understanding, helping them navigate these multifaceted issues in an informed and balanced way.
The podcast is supported by the Washington University School of Public Health—https://schoolofpublichealth.washu.edu—and the Frick Initiative.
Host: Dr. Salma Abdalla
Editors: Catalina Melendez Contreras and Zachary Linhares
Music: Eden Avery / Melting Glass from Epidemic Sound https://www.epidemicsound.com/track/2fqOXWpHab/
Contact us at: s.abdalla@wustl.edu
