In this conversation, Dr. Victor Montori discusses the importance of careful and kind care in healthcare, contrasting it with the industrialized medicine model that often processes patients rather than caring for them. He emphasizes the need for systems that enable deep human connections between caregivers and care receivers, the significance of reframing patient non-compliance, and the concept of minimally disruptive medicine. Montori also highlights the power of shared decision-making and the challenges posed by current payment models in healthcare. The discussion culminates in an introduction to the Patient Revolution, a movement aimed at transforming healthcare into a more compassionate and patient-centered system.
Chapters
00:00 The Essence of Caregiving
01:43 Introduction to Dr. Victor Montori
05:23 Industrialized Medicine vs. Careful and Kind Care
10:24 Reframing Non-Compliance in Patients
14:18 Minimally Disruptive Medicine Explained
17:11 The Power of Shared Decision Making
21:27 Navigating Payment Models in Healthcare
26:27 Bright Spots and Opportunities in Care
30:40 The Patient Revolution: A Call to Action
What does it mean to truly die well? In this episode of The Other Side of the Chart, Dr. Jill Goldenberg sits down with Dr. Barbara Morris a geriatrician, advocate, founder of Geriatric Advocacy & Consulting, and co-founder and President of End of Life Options Colorado to explore the evolving landscape of end-of-life care.
Dr. Morris shares her vision of what she calls “the symphony of their last days” — a model of care that is synchronized, compassionate, and centered on patient choice. Together, we unpack how hospice, palliative care, and medical aid in dying are changing in Colorado and beyond, and what it takes to bring dignity, agency, and humanity into the hardest conversations in medicine.
This episode is a reminder that healthcare is not just about extending life, but about honoring it right up to the very end.
🔗 Learn more: End of Life Options Colorado | Dr. Barbara Morris
In this episode of The Other Side of the Chart, host Dr. Jill Goldenberg sits down with Dr. Kevin Larsen, Senior Vice President of Clinical Innovation and former leader at CMS and ONC, to explore the evolution of medical documentation, from handwritten charts to AI-generated notes.
Together, they unpack how documentation has shifted from a clinician’s memory aid to a complex record serving patients, payers, regulators, and more. The conversation spans the promise and pitfalls of OpenNotes, the elusive goal of a true longitudinal care plan, and the early “Nokia cell phone” stage of ambient AI in healthcare.
With stories from his career leading health systems, policy, and innovation, Dr. Larsen reflects on how documentation can either widen the distance between people or bring them closer together. At its core, the discussion asks: Who is the medical note really for and how can it better serve patients and clinicians alike?
🎙️ Episode 1: Living the System – What Patients Wish We Knew
Guest: Dalia – lawyer, mom, patient, and lifelong “VIP” (very involved patient)
Summary:
In this powerful premiere episode, host Dr. Jill Goldenberg sits down with Dalia, a lawyer and mother who has spent her entire life navigating the healthcare system. Diagnosed with her first tumor as a toddler and with multiple distinct cancers over the years, Dalia shares what it’s like to live on the receiving end of a system that often feels impersonal, disjointed, and difficult to navigate — even for the most informed patients.
Dalia opens up about:
The emotional toll of living with chronic, life-threatening illness
Moments of both dismissal and deep compassion in her care
The importance of open notes and patient access to the medical record
How system design — from scheduling to physical space — shapes patient experience
Her vision for a better healthcare system that integrates public health, social supports, and simplified processes
Through Dalia’s story, we’re reminded that healthcare is personal, and the systems we build must reflect that. This episode is essential listening for anyone designing or delivering care — and for those ready to reimagine healthcare with patients at the center.
Welcome to The Other Side of the Chart — a podcast for healthcare leaders in technology, operations, and policy... and for anyone who's ever felt lost in the system.
Hosted by Dr. Jill Goldenberg, a physician and leader in clinical informatics and value-based care, this show explores what healthcare could be if we designed it around real people. Each episode features candid conversations with patients, clinicians, and innovators — uncovering the human stories behind the data and the systems behind the care.
In this short teaser, you’ll hear a glimpse from our premiere episode with Dalia — a lawyer, mom, and lifelong patient living with multiple cancers. And in our second episode, Dr. Kevin Larson joins us to unpack what clinical notes are really for — and what happens when patients can finally read them.
Subscribe now and join us as we reimagine a healthcare system that works better for everyone — on both sides of the chart.
Upcoming Episodes:
Episode 1: Dalia’s Story — What Patients Wish We Knew
Episode 2: For the Record: Who Are We Documenting For with Dr. Kevin Larsen
Credits:
Intro/outro music: “Relaxing Motivational Corporate” by Fretbound, licensed under CC BY 4.0.
freemusicarchive.org/music/fretbound
Connect with Jill Goldenberg on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jillgoldenberg