Today, we have a Modesty Files first as we welcome mother and daughter duo, Kathy and Christine to the show. Kathy and Christine journeyed through IBLP together throughout her daughter, Christine’s, formative years. Through their time at IBLP, both Kathy and Christine interacted with Bill Gothard, and in this episode, they detail the strange way Gothard interacted differently with mothers and their teen daughters. Kathy and Christine have an honest conversation about their differing perspectives on the situation at the time.

Topics in this episode include mature adult themes, so listener discretion is advised.

So it’s time to strip that modesty cover, put on some comfy pants, and let’s catch up with Kathy and Christine on this week’s episode of the modesty files!


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On today’s “Where are They Now” special episode we’re speaking with April, one of our Season 2 guests. While her episode was released in 2021, we recorded with her in 2020. Since chatting, April has quit her job for good at a white evangelical church and is finally ready to share an additional piece of her story that she wasn’t ready to speak about at the time.

We recommend relistening to Episode #20 - Girl, You're a Missionary: April's Divine Calling to Study at the Masters Commission so you can jump straight into the new one!

Content Warning: This episode includes the use of strong language, so listener discretion is advised.

So it’s time to strip that modesty cover, put on some comfy pants, and let’s catch up with April on this week’s episode of the modesty files!

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Today we’re speaking with Sarah, who left the Church of Christ about a decade ago. After having an abortion at age 19, she felt so guilty that she vowed that the next person she would date she would marry. However, she ended up trapped in an abusive marriage. Their relationship started with love-bombing and eventually turned into heavy verbal abuse and manipulation. Her pastors encouraged her to remain married because, “you can’t divorce your husband just because he’s mean to you.” Sarah remained inside the cycle of abuse until she finally escaped a year and a half later.

A brief content warning, we will be discussing physical and emotional abuse and other mature themes, which may be upsetting, so listener discretion is advised.

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Content Warning: We spend a fair amount of time in this episode discussing suicide and abuse, which may be upsetting, so listener discretion is advised.

We have a very special show for you today. In Season 2, we released an episode featuring Julie and the Pentecostal Community she grew up in. Julie’s congregation was run by a female pastor who members referred to as “Granny.” She encouraged adult men to get vasectomies and forced teenagers to clean offices at night. Well, today we are continuing this story. Our guest, Billy, is a close friend of Julie’s and was also a member of Granny’s toxic church environment. He’s going to share with us his experience inside the church and how he eventually left this high control group

We highly recommend going back to listen to episode #15 to learn more about the church’s practices and beliefs, but if you want to jump right in, you should be good to follow along.

If you, or someone you know, is struggling with suicide ideation, please use the following resources:
Suicide Hotline: 800-273-8255
Crisis Text Hotline: Text "HOME" to 741741

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Today, we are speaking with Anne Jisca, a Canadian woman and former evangelical missionary. She participated in short-term mission trips as a teenager, and after getting married at 22, she and her husband, Josiah, pursued full-time missionary work all over the world. During that time, Anne Jisca gave birth to five children, and the pressure of being the perfect missionary started to build up. Her mental and physical health suffered, and in 2019, Anne Jisca and Josiah decided to leave missionary work for good.

Topics in this episode include suicide ideation and other mature adult themes, so listener discretion is advised.

After leaving the church in March 2020, She and Josiah began a podcast of their own called Seeking Health, where they aim to bring fun and informative discussions about deconstruction, reconstruction, health, and hope in a post-evangelical world.

You can listen to Anne Jisca's podcast "Seeking Health" here: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/seeking-health-with-josiah-anne-jisca-meyer/id668410493

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In this episode we discuss physical child abuse, sexual assault, suicide ideation, and other topics that may be upsetting, so listener discretion is advised.

Today we’re speaking with Clarissa, who is here to share with us the fundamentalist teachings that were enforced in her home. Her parents were primarily influenced by Michael and Debi Pearl, writers of the 1994 book “To Train Up a Child.” This book encourages parents to use corporal punishment and has sold hundreds of thousands of copies to evangelical Christians since its release. Clarissa’s parents inflicted these abusive practices on her younger siblings and justified the actions with their religious beliefs. Clarissa is now sharing her story to shed light on this abusive parenting ideology.

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On today's episode, we're speaking with Allie, who is here to share with us her experience growing up influenced by the Advanced Training Institute. She spent most of her childhood focused on perfection, like following her parents' rules or protecting her purity. Her interactions with the organization’s leader, Bill Gothard, left her feeling uneasy and confused about her relationship with faith. But as she grew older, she started to question why following human made rules supposedly led to rewards from God. Ultimately, Allie decided to walk away from the Gothard teachings and break from the regulations that once defined her.

Topics in this episode include mature adult themes, so listener discretion is advised.

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Today, we are speaking with AnnaMarie, a woman who has recently left the Mormon church. The Mormon church is one of the newest Christian denominations and also has one of the most unique origin stories. AnnaMarie was born into and grew up in the Mormon Church and accepted its customs as ordinary until she went off to college. She was committed to her role and the expectations of her church, but when she tried to leave quietly she was stalked by missionaries in the group. She’ll get into the details on her involvement and more in today’s episode.

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On today’s show, we’re speaking with Alex, a woman who was raised in United Pentecostal Church International. She attended an Independent Fundamentalist Baptist school whose practices were heavily influenced by its neighbor, Bob Jones University. She frequently visited the campus for sports and music recitals, and had to follow all of the required rules. Alex is going to share with us what religious practices she followed growing up and how breaking away from the church allowed her to embrace her sexuality as a queer woman.

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Today we’re continuing our conversation with Lindsey. Last week, she shared with us was it was like growing in ATI culture and working with Bill Gothard at Headquarters for the Advanced Training Institute. If you haven’t listened to Part One, we highly recommend going back to hear Lindsey's story from the beginning. Lindsey is going to share with us how she ultimately left ATI, fell in love, and started a new life for herself outside of the church.

Topics in this episode include mature adult themes, so listener discretion is advised.

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Welcome to SEASON THREE of The Modesty Files! On today's episode, we're speaking with Lindsey, a former member of Advanced Training Institute, the infamous homeschool curriculum created by Bill Gothard. While we know our guest as Lindsey, for those on TikTok, you may know her as at @cultchronicles. Looking for something to do at the start of quarantine, Lindsey decided to re-read her old journals and document her re-exploration of the past on TikTok. She went viral, and people were fascinated by the stories she was sharing. But more importantly, Lindsey discovered that opening up about her life in ATI was what she needed to finally begin her healing process. So today, instead of hearing Lindsey's experience growing up in ATI in a 1-minute video, we have two episodes to explore the depths of her upbringing.

Topics in this episode include mature adult themes, so listener discretion is advised.

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On today’s “Where are they now” special episode we’re talking with one of our season 1 guests, Lydia. She was the first one to introduce us to Christian purity culture and Josh Harris's book “I Kissed Dating Goodbye.” Lydia shared with us last year that she had yet to have her first kiss, and while we’ll let Lydia share with us what she has been up, let’s say it’s almost as perfect as a hallmark movie.

We highly recommend going back and listening to her episode in season 1, episode 8 to hear her complete story.

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On today’s “Where are They Now” special episode we’re talking with Angela, who was a guest in Season 1. She comes from a Pentecostal background and taught us all about the church’s rituals, such as healing and speaking in tongues, her experience being a pastor’s kid, and what it means to take a “liberal” stance on sex education and morals. We highly recommend going back and listening to her episode in Season 1, Episode 9 to hear her complete story.

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Today we’re continuing our conversation with Jenni, an alum from Bob Jones University. If you haven’t listened to Part One, we highly recommend going back to hear Jenni's story from the beginning. She explained to us many of the rules enforced by the school and how challenging it was for Jenni to come out as a queer. Jenni going to share with us what it was like to undergo years of conversion therapy, what led her to leave fundamentalism, and how she learned to embrace her true self as a queer woman.

Topics in this episode include abuse, mental health difficulties, and other mature themes, so listener discretion is advised.

This is the last episode of Season 2 of The Modesty Files! Thank you once again to all the incredible people that we’ve spoken to this year and the supporters we’ve connected with along the way. We’ll be back in September for Season Three, so in the meantime, please to leave us a rating or review wherever you listen to your podcasts, follow us on Instagram and support us over on Patreon to get access to bonus segments throughout the summer.

And one final thank you to our female power squad: Allison, Amanda, Caroline, Emma, Kelsey, Janelle, Jessica, Savannah, and Sophie for helping us bring season two to life.

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Today we are speaking with Jenni, an alum from Bob Jones University, a private, non-denominational evangelical university in Greenville, South Carolina. It is known for its conservative cultural and religious positions. At Bob Jones, Jenni had to abide by strict rules enforced by the school, like a bell that rang at 11 pm and 7 am for mandatory bedtime and wake time every day. The university fostered a “tattling culture” and so as Jenni discover her sexual identity, it made coming out as a queer person pretty difficult. Jenni is here today to share all the details about Bob Jones and her incredible coming out story.

Topics in this episode include mature themes, so listener discretion is advised.

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On today’s episode, we’re joined by Nick, a former member of the Church of the Brethren. Growing up, Nick expressed many questions about her non-denominational faith and religious practices. She had a hard time performing the role she had to play for the church community. As queer person, Nick struggle with the church’s required head covering, dresses on sunday, overall traditional femmine expectations. The Brethren openly opposed same-sex marriage and these teachings became problematic as Nick grew older and started exploring her sexual identity. Her religious beliefs began to fade in college and her involvement on Tumblr and fandoms helped her realize the importance of self-expression and freedom in creating your own identity.

Topics in this episode include mature adult themes, so listener discretion is advised.

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Welcome back to the second episode of our Pride Month celebration series. Today we’re speaking with Martina, a queer woman from Belgum who’s going to share with us her unique experience with the Mormon church. After a traumatic incident as a teen, Martina was searching for a community of people. She encountered a group of Mormon missionaries and her friendship with them turned into a slow boil of indoctrination into the church. She fell for the love bombing, and soon enough, the church convinced her that she “struggled with same-sex attraction” and that she could easily fall in love with a man. After a year of participating in Mormon practices and attempting to deny her sexuality, Martina decided on the day of her baptism that she needed to leave the Mormon church for good.

Topics in this episode include mature adult themes, so listener discretion is advised.

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Today is the first episode of our Pride Month celebration series. We’re bringing to you five incredible episodes from people in the LGBTQA+ community who have left fundamentalism.

We’re kicking off our series with an interview with Elizabeth Hunter, or @ThatLizHunter for those who know her from Instagram and TikTok. Elizabeth has spent the last year on social media documenting her experiences growing up influenced by Bill Gothard's homeschool curriculum, the Advanced Training Institute. Additionally, Elizabeth attended Bob Jones University and was almost kicked out of the school for her sexuality. Administrators threatened her student status after she tweeted “Happy Pride” and wrote a book with lesbian characters. Now in 2021, Elizabeth is participating as a plaintiff in a lawsuit against the U.S. Department of Education. She’ll get into the details on her involvement and more in today’s episode.

Topics in this episode include physical and sexual abuse, depression, and other mature themes, so listener discretion is advised.

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Today’s guest is Halt and he’s going to share with us his male perspective of what it was like attending a Non-denominational Christian school in Las Vegas. From Kindergarten through 12th grade, Halt was immersed in Christianized education. He received very little sex education and participated in purity banquets, pledging that they would maintain their virginity for marriage. Halt’s history courses also focused on white-washed history topics like Great Replacement Theory and used “Apologetics” to justify their teachers. Halt finally began to question his beliefs as a junior in high school when he began taking non-sanitized history courses at the local college.

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On today's episode, we're speaking with Kez, who joins us all the way from the other side of the world in Australia. She is here today to share with us her experience growing up in the Independent Baptist church, and how the Advanced Training Institute homeschool curriculum was implemented in her home. Growing up as a pastor's kid, Kez faced the pressures of perfection and was isolated from anyone outside her IB community. Her father even became a key player in bringing fundamentalist figures, like Bill Gothard and SM Davis, to Australia. Kez struggled for years with mental health challenges but eventually escaped to seek help and discovered what freedom felt like on the outside.

Trigger warnings for topics including child sexual abuse and suicidal ideation. Listener discretion advised.

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