Deana Lewis chats with Beth Richie and Alisa Bierria about the historical context and motivations behind their influential books that have been informed by and inform abolition feminism. Emphasizing practice as a lead to theory, both authors discuss the importance of their decades long on-the-ground work in the anti-violence movement, the struggle against anti-Black racism and the defense of criminalized survivors as a long arc towards freedom. They also reflect on their shared grounding in f...