Ashley Lewin has audited 30+ companies in her career and seen the same pattern: marketing teams stuck chasing MQLs while revenue stalls. In this episode, Carolyn and Trevor dig into Ashley’s perspective on why MQLs keep organizations trapped in short-term thinking, and how she’s applying those lessons now as Head of Marketing at Aligned.
We talk through what it takes to stand up a marketing function from scratch at a hybrid PLG + sales-assisted company, why implementing HubSpot’s Lead object was a foundational bet, and how “fail fast” disqualification changed the way BDRs and sales managers manage their pipeline.
Ashley also shares her playbook for winning executive buy-in: showing CEOs a predictable growth equation that replaces lead volume with qualified pipeline and product activation.
What You’ll Learn:
If your growth plan still relies on lead math, you’re running on outdated assumptions. Ashley shows how to build a system that actually scales revenue, not just reporting.
🔗 LINKS
Register for our Oct 8 Pipeline KPI Workshop
Follow GTM Live on Spotify
Subscribe to the GTM Live YouTube Channel
Connect with Carolyn on LinkedIn
Connect with Ashley on LinkedIn
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This episode is powered by Passetto, a technology-enabled GTM advisory with a solution that eliminates the Pipeline Black Box™, the critical data hidden inside every GTM engine where leaders are flying blind when it matters most.
If your board asks “Why is pipeline down?” and your opportunity dashboards only say marketing-sourced vs. SDR-sourced (AKA the four-funnel model), you’re stuck with surface-level data and left guessing at fixes instead of diagnosing the problem.
The real story lives between engagement and opportunity, the unmeasured factory floor where prospecting happens (or dies). In this episode, Carolyn and Amber show how to rip the lid off that black box, swap vanity volume for "causal" metrics, and find the repeatable patterns that actually manufacture pipeline.
Expect blunt takes, practical questions to bring to RevOps tomorrow, and real outcomes from teams who’ve made the shift (e.g., win rates jumping from ~13% to ~24% and easier budget approvals once the black box is illuminated).
What You’ll Learn:
Who This Episode For
CROs, CMOs, Demand leaders, and RevOps owners ready to graduate from MQLs/last-touch to a factory-style measurement system.
🔗 LINKS
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This episode is powered by Passetto, a GTM advisory and instrumentation software company with a solution that eliminates the Pipeline Black Box™, the critical data hidden inside every GTM engine where leaders are flying blind when it matters most.
In this episode of GTM Live, Carolyn joins the Growth Activated Podcast as a guest to unpack one of the biggest blind spots in GTM today: what actually happens before an opportunity is created.
99% of GTM teams still can’t see this stage clearly. It’s the “grey area” where SDRs and BDRs are grinding—sending emails, making calls, chasing signals, running sequences—all in the hope of booking a meeting that turns into pipeline.
The problem? None of this activity is tracked in a clear, causal way. Leaders only see pipeline “sources” (marketing, sales, SDR), which hides the bigger story. Pipeline isn’t a source—it’s a chain reaction. A trigger sparks sales work, a series of events unfolds, and only some of those reliably convert to opportunities. Most of it? Invisible. That’s why pipeline creation still feels like guesswork.
Carolyn explains why source-based reporting and last-touch attribution keep teams stuck, and how to instrument the pre-opportunity “factory floor” with simple metrics that expose what’s really working.
Key Topics in this Episode:
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This episode is powered by Passetto, a GTM advisory and instrumentation software company with a solution that eliminates the Pipeline Black Box™, the critical data hidden inside every GTM engine where leaders are flying blind when it matters most.
Most GTM teamstoday are missing targets because they're simply measuring the wrong things. In this episode, Carolyn and Amber unpack why attribution is a mirage (it only shows the lucky 2% that become opportunities) and why the MQL hamster wheel keeps smart teams stuck optimizing a tiny slice of reality. We dig into the pre-pipeline “factory floor,” show how to expose the messy middle, and explain why “more volume” isn’t a strategy—it’s a cash leak.
You’ll hear concrete ways to replace vanity conversion stats with a causal view of attempts → connects → meetings → opps → DQs (with reasons), what to do about pipeline shock when you tighten scoring, and why pipeline needs a single owner (hint: not “marketing-sourced”).
We also talk about modular change vs. big-bang transformations, and where attribution actually belongs (as seasoning, not the main ingredient), dig into where attribution actually belongs in GTM measurement (spoiler: it’s seasoning, not the protein), and explain why modular change beats waiting for a full-scale transformation.
What You’ll Learn:
Attribution ≠ answers: It validates the 2-5% that convert and hides the waste in the 98%.
Kill the MQL hamster wheel: Measure the journey, not just MQL→SQL%.
Instrument the factory floor: Person-level steps that predict pipeline (and the drop-offs to fix).
Volume lies: “Do more dials” is a 2012 play—engineer repeatable patterns instead.
Pipeline shock is healthy: Fewer junk opps → higher win rate and better CAC.
One owner for pipeline: Align Sales + Marketing on quality pipeline, not credit.
When to use attribution: After you fix data hygiene and pre-pipeline tracking.
If your dashboards keep telling you to “get more leads” or “add more dials,” you’re staring at the pipeline mirage. Break free from the hamster wheel, shine a light on the messy middle, and finally see what’s really driving, or draining, your revenue.
This episode is powered by Passetto, a GTM advisory and software company with a solution that eliminates the Pipeline Black Box™, the critical data hidden inside every GTM engine where leaders are flying blind when it matters most.
🔗 LINKS & CTAs
Most companies are flying blind at the most important stage in revenue creation. Decisions get made on gut feel, data lives in silos, and leaders can’t answer the simplest question: what’s really working, and what’s not?
On this episode of GTM Live, Carolyn and Trevor are joined by their new co-host Amber Williams, Head of Revenue Operations at Passetto, to unpack why GTM leaders need to treat revenue like a science – bringing structure, data, and predictability to the go-to-market engine.
The hosts dive into why leaders often make decisions based on instinct instead of data, how poor data architecture creates hidden risks for growth, and why building visibility into every stage of the funnel is critical for confident decision-making.
The team also tackles the cross-functional blame game—why marketing and sales point fingers over handoffs and lead quality when the real problem is a lack of shared visibility. Without a unified view of the pipeline, every GTM function is forced to defend itself in silos instead of solving the bigger issue together.
Key moments in this episode:
[03:15] Why “more tech” in 2025 doesn’t mean more clarity
[08:42] The pipeline black box and what RevOps needs to uncover
[16:30] Why gut-driven GTM decisions break down at scale
[22:05] The hidden cost of poor data architecture on growth and trust
[31:47] How systematic revenue visibility transforms executive decision-making
This episode is powered by Passetto, a GTM advisory and software company with a solution that eliminates the Pipeline Black Box™, the critical data hidden inside every GTM engine where leaders are flying blind when it matters most.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn and Trevor sit down with Mark Turner, VP of Revenue Operations at Demandbase, to break down how RevOps leaders can build aligned systems, drive better GTM execution, and measure what actually matters.
Mark shares how his early background in FP&A shaped his leadership approach, bringing a data-first, analytical mindset to RevOps that balances strategic planning with operational precision. He also unpacks what it really takes to build a unified data layer across the GTM org, and why consistent definitions and connected systems are key to moving fast and measuring effectively.
Key topics in this episode:
This episode is powered by Passetto, a GTM advisory and software company helping B2B teams build Revenue Sciences™, a measurable system that uncovers bottlenecks and data gaps, transforming go-to-market into a closed-loop engine for confident, scalable growth.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn sits down with Sam Dunning, SEO leader and B2B growth expert, to unpack how SEO has dramatically evolved and what top-performing companies must do to adapt.
They dive into why traditional SEO—focused on keywords, rankings, and traffic—is now too siloed, and how modern SEO needs to align with revenue, messaging, and the full customer journey.
They also explore outdated SEO metrics, the pitfalls of last-touch attribution, and why shifting to a revenue-influence mindset is essential.
You’ll hear what modern SEO looks like in a revenue-led org, how category narrative (not keyword stuffing) is the new growth lever, and how AI is reshaping both content production and search behavior.
Together, Carolyn and Sam challenge the idea that SEO can be a standalone marketing channel, it’s a powerful GTM distribution engine when done right.
Key topics in this episode:
Why SEO can’t be a silo anymore
How to reframe SEO as a distribution strategy, not just a traffic engine
Why aligning SEO with your company’s POV drives better outcomes
How AI is reshaping the content and SEO landscape
Why B2B companies need to track influence, not just rankings or leads
The biggest SEO measurement mistakes teams still make
What high-performing teams are doing differently with content
📣 Share this with any marketer or RevOps leader still tracking SEO like it’s 2015.
This episode is powered by Passetto, a GTM advisory and software company that helps B2B SaaS teams achieve true Revenue Visibility. We work alongside revenue leaders to expose data blind spots, build the right data infrastructure, and eliminate the pipeline black hole. Visit passetto.com.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn sits down with Dave Boyce, Executive Chair at Winning by Design and longtime SaaS builder, to explore why GTM systems are breaking, and what modern companies must do differently to build for predictable, customer-centered growth.
They dive into what Dave calls “the layers of sediment” that have built up over time, e.g. commissions, org design, reporting structures, and outdated dashboards, and why those legacy systems are misaligned with today’s buying behavior.
They also talk about the real challenges CROs are facing right now: Deals are harder to win, old tactics aren’t working, and most GTM teams are stuck optimizing for the wrong outcomes.
You’ll hear practical examples of what high-performing companies like Atlassian are doing differently, the importance of empathy in system design, and why the CEO—not just Sales or Marketing—needs to own this transformation.
Together, they unpack why most GTM strategies break down. And it’s not because of effort, but because they lack system design.
Key topics in this episode:
The broken layers of GTM measurement, and why that era is over
Why commissions often reinforce short-term, self-interested behavior
Why visibility across the full funnel/bowtie is essential for accountability and improvement
The "Andon Cord" concept from Toyota and what GTM can learn from it
Why the CEO must own GTM system design (and why FP&A is the ideal quarterback)
What Atlassian does differently to align around the customer
📣 Share this with an exec who still thinks GTM is a funnel.
This episode is powered by Passetto. We help high-growth and equity-backed companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit passetto.com.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn and Trevor walk through a practical, step-by-step breakdown of how companies should be measuring GTM performance—beyond the outdated funnel reports and measurement models that most teams are still relying on.
This episode is structured like a mini masterclass: You’ll learn the real stages of the GTM revenue factory, what metrics to track at each one, and how to spot the signals that lead to qualified pipeline before opportunities even exist.
They also cover how most common GTM measurement systems fail, and what leading companies are doing instead, and why this shift helps teams make better, faster decisions across Marketing, Sales, and RevOps.
Whether you’re struggling to prove impact, spot performance issues early, or get your execs aligned on what’s actually driving growth—this one’s for you.
Key topics in this episode:
Why funnel reports and common Marketing metrics often give a false sense of progress
The disconnect between GTM activity and what leaders actually want to know
How to rethink pipeline measurement and what metrics to rely on as your north star
What high-performing companies are tracking at each GTM stage
How to evolve your dashboard into a true Revenue Command Center
This episode is powered by Passetto. We help high-growth and equity-backed companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit passetto.com.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn unpacks one of the most deeply ingrained—but damaging—habits in B2B go-to-market: measuring success based on which department sourced the deal.
While many marketing leaders know this approach doesn’t reflect reality, changing it is hard, especially in legacy orgs with outdated attribution models, internal inertia, and leadership that still demands simple answers to complex questions.
In this solo episode, Carolyn breaks down the real problem: measuring performance by team creates siloed decision-making, warped incentives, and misses what actually moves buyers through the funnel.
You’ll hear why the future of GTM performance measurement is about mapping buyer behavior across an interconnected journey, not slicing credit by department. And she shares the exact 5-part framework Passetto uses to help teams ditch "department-sourced" for something far more accurate and impactful.
If you’ve ever struggled to prove Marketing’s full impact, or if your exec team is still obsessed with MQLs and last-touch attribution, this episode will hit home.
Key topics in this episode:
Why “department source” attribution is outdated and misleading
The real structure of a modern buyer journey
How this model leads to misaligned KPIs and credit battles
Why most GTM teams lack the data architecture to measure what matters
A new framework to measure engagement, prospecting, and sales as one integrated system
This episode is powered by Passetto. We help high-growth and equity-backed B2B SaaS companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit passetto.com.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn sits down with Megan Bowen, CEO of Refine Labs, to unpack why so many B2B companies are pouring budget into paid media, and still missing revenue targets.
They break down what’s really going wrong: not too much paid media, but too much spend on a strategy that doesn’t convert. Pipeline is down. Revenue is down. And yet, the response is often to spend more, not better.
You’ll hear why performance marketing often fails to deliver real outcomes, how misaligned KPIs drive bad decisions, and what separates newer, agile companies from legacy players still running outdated GTM playbooks.
Megan shares insights from working with dozens of growth-stage companies and how leadership mindset, speed of iteration, and willingness to challenge old assumptions can make or break your demand strategy.
If you’ve been trying to defend paid spend, or wondering why results are flat despite doing “all the right things”, this episode is for you.
Key topics in this episode:
Why paid media often fails to convert to pipeline or revenue
The difference between new-school and old-school GTM teams
Why optimizing for MQLs leads to the wrong outcomes
How to rethink measurement for real demand capture
What high-performing growth teams do differently
This episode is powered by Passetto. We help high-growth and equity-backed companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit passetto.com.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn and Trevor unpack the 9 go-to-market dysfunctions quietly derailing growth at even the most ambitious B2B companies.
They dig into why so many teams, despite big budgets, headcount, and tools, are still struggling to drive efficient growth.
Spoiler: it’s not the people. It’s the system.
You’ll hear why fragmented data, financial secrecy, and siloed ownership are causing misalignment across marketing, sales, finance, and CS. And what it takes to rebuild GTM as a unified, accountable system.
Trevor breaks down the real role of RevOps (and why it’s failing in most orgs), while Carolyn makes the case for ditching vanity metrics and rethinking how you measure and invest in growth.
If you’re questioning whether your CAC is sustainable or your GTM truly aligned, this one’s for you.
Key topics in this episode:
This episode is powered by Passetto.
We help high-growth companies build the GTM system they should’ve had all along: measurable, connected, and built for real growth. We integrate your CRM, financials, and GTM data to uncover what’s working, what’s not, and what to do next.
Part platform, part advisory. All about clarity.
Learn more at passetto.com.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn sits down with Nick Flamini, host of the Sales Architecture Podcast, to explore the real reasons most go-to-market teams are still struggling—despite all the headcount, tools, and budget.
They dig into the myth of “more BDRs = more pipeline,” and why most organizations are missing the data, architecture, and cross-functional alignment required to scale efficiently.
Carolyn explains why “go-to-market bloat” is a symptom of deeper system issues, not bad people. She shares how Passetto is helping companies rethink how they connect marketing, sales, finance, and RevOps through a unified GTM data layer.
Nick challenges the hype around AI in outbound, and the two unpack why trust, process, and measurement (not volume) are the levers that matter most.
If you’ve ever questioned whether your CAC is actually sustainable, or felt stuck trying to prove marketing’s impact, this episode is your blueprint.
Key topics in this episode:
This episode is powered by Passetto. We help high-growth and equity-backed companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit passetto.com
Most SaaS teams claim they’re “doing PLG,” but very few are doing it well.
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn and Trevor sit down with Wes Bush, CEO of ProductLed, to unpack why product-led growth often fails—and what to do about it. They explore why PLG isn’t just a pricing model or trial strategy, but a deep, systems-level shift that most teams underestimate.
Wes shares the “PLG iceberg” framework: how surface-level features (like a free trial) are only a fraction of the equation, and what’s really beneath the waterline. Carolyn draws parallels to GTM systems and explains why execution gaps usually stem from unseen issues like misaligned metrics, siloed teams, or weak infrastructure. Trevor reveals why so many companies stall out after initial traction and how to diagnose whether PLG is truly viable for your product and team.
If your version of PLG starts and ends with a self-serve signup, this conversation will change your thinking.
Key topics in this episode:
Why most PLG initiatives stall or fail to scale
The “iceberg” analogy for understanding real PLG systems
How internal misalignment derails otherwise solid PLG ideas
Why surface-level success metrics are misleading
What CEOs and GTM leaders get wrong when trying to “go PLG”
What foundational systems need to be in place before you can succeed with PLG
📘 Grab Wes Bush’s free e-book “Product-Led Growth: How to Build a Product That Sells Itself” at productled.com/book/product-led-growth
This episode is powered by Passetto. We help high-growth and equity-backed companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit passetto.com
Everyone’s analyzing win rates, but too few teams are asking the harder question: how did that opportunity even begin?
This week on GTM Live, Trevor and Carolyn break down the most overlooked stage in go-to-market: what happens before a lead becomes a lead. They unpack why early-funnel signals (the ones that come before forms, meetings, or MQL scores) are where your growth strategy is made or broken.
They explain why it’s not enough to measure performance after the fact, and how traditional attribution misses the hidden work happening in the earliest phases of pipeline creation.
Carolyn explains how early signal data is shaping a new standard for pipeline visibility, and Trevor shows how to connect that data to real decisions: budget, headcount, channels, and more.
If your GTM reporting starts at the opportunity stage, you’re already behind.
Key topics in this episode:
This episode is powered by Passetto. We help high-growth and equity-backed companies turn GTM data into better decisions, faster. We unify your GTM and financial data, identify your growth levers, and help you scale. Part SaaS, part advisory. Visit passetto.com
Everyone’s trying to grow pipeline, but only few companies are measuring the part of GTM that actually creates it.
This week on GTM Live, Trevor and Carolyn expose why the early-stage “signals” that actually drive pipeline are the ones most teams ignore.
They dig into the real problem: teams aren’t tracking signals across the entire pipeline creation journey. Instead, they're relying on last-touch or deal source attribution that tells you nothing about what’s actually working. Trevor explains why so many GTM decisions are disconnected from cost and impact, while Carolyn shares why she believes most attribution reporting is a smokescreen.
This episode makes the case for a new standard: tracking what prospects are engaging with before they hit a lead score or sales touches them, and tying that behavior to outcomes. If your prospecting motion isn’t part of your GTM analysis, you’re missing the whole story.
Key topics in this episode:
This week on GTM Live, Carolyn and Trevor dive into the messiness of go-to-market strategy: overspending on pipeline, bad attribution models, and why marketers are often stuck doing RevOps jobs.
Carolyn breaks down the trap of chasing new logos without clear ROI, while Trevor shares how his IT-to-marketing journey led to launching Passetto to fix these exact issues. They get into why data architecture matters before building strategy, and how single-touch attribution is holding teams back.
Stick around for listener Q&A, lessons learned from the trenches, and real talk on what actually drives growth.
Key topics in this episode:
Why most GTM strategies fall apart without strong data foundations
The hidden cost of single-touch attribution
What marketing leaders shouldn’t be doing (hint: RevOps)
How to think about ROI before chasing pipeline
Lessons learned from building Passetto to solve these problems
Come hang with us live during our weekly podcast recording—tune in, ask questions, and be part of the convo. Grab your spot at passetto.com/events.
After a month-long sabbatical that took him across Australia, New Zealand, and Fiji, Chris Walker returns to Revenue Vitals with a life-changing announcement.
In this deeply personal episode, Chris reveals a profound shift in his perspective and purpose that has led him to hand over hosting duties to Carolyn Dilks (Co-Founder and Managing Partner @ Passetto) who will be rebranding the show to “GTM Live”, while he embarks on a new mission.
Sharing intimate details about his personal transformation through self-reflection and experiencing "operating system upgrades," Chris outlines his new mission for helping others unlock their innate human potential.
This is the start of a new chapter for Revenue Vitals, which will now become “GTM Live” hosted by Carolyn Dilks.
And it is a new chapter for Chris, who will be announcing his new podcast and mission in even more details soon.
Stay tuned for more.
In this unique episode, Chris shares the unfiltered audio from a consulting call with an entrepreneur. Chris offers advice from his personal experience building multiple businesses to 7 and 8 figures in revenue.
Here’s what you’ll learn in this episode:
Why raising VC money might be a sign that your business model needs rethinking
The advantages of bootstrapping a SaaS company to $5-10M ARR
How a SaaS + services model creates better financial outcomes and product development
Why "slow is fast" in building sustainable businesses
The dangers of rapid scaling and how it often leads to revenue regression
How to structure equity and compensation in early-stage companies
The math behind exit outcomes and why 100% ownership of a smaller company often beats partial ownership of a larger one
Building customer success into your model rather than outsourcing it
Why the feedback loop from direct customer service dramatically improves product development
Real numbers from Chris's journey growing his agency from $11M to $22M and back to $12M
Today’s episode is a live fireside chat recorded at Warmly’s office, where Chris covers why smaller software companies can move faster than larger ones, what customers actually want versus what they say they need, and practical ways to measure what matters in marketing.
Here’s what you’ll learn in this episode:
Why smaller companies have distinct advantages over $100M+ companies today
The critical importance of making customers successful with your product (not just selling it)
How AI is accelerating product development and changing business operations
Why competitive differentiation now requires more than just features and messaging
The shift from "giving away customer success" to charging for services that drive results
Rethinking traditional department structures like marketing, sales, and RevOps
Why attribution models are fundamentally flawed and how to approach measurement differently
The problem with sales compensation models that don't align with today's buying journey
Creating defensibility through customer proximity, delivering results, and leveraging proprietary data
How to consider pricing models based on deliverables instead of traditional subscriptions
