In this episode, Matt and Dan do what good Catholics do: overthink their vocations. But this time, they’re not just being Catholic laymen but being Chinese Catholic laymen (yes, it matters, and yes, we’ll unpack that).
Matt goes off about the Church’s unspoken two-track economy - one clerical and another lay, while Dan wonders aloud if theology has a built-in side-eye for the laity as “the non-ordained”.
Then the two wander into the papal magisterium (because we contain multitudes) and discover not just a grudging nod toward the idea of a theologically trained laity, but an actual theology of the laity. Wild. So why, they ask, do we still act like being lay is a consolation prize and not an actual calling?
Finally, in a rare moment of optimism, they look back at moments in Church history when it was precisely the laity who held things together - the unsung, unpaid, unordained backbone of Catholic life – and they ask what that history might mean for how the laity live out the Church’s mission today. Come for the ecclesiology, stay for the low-key identity crisis.
Resources:
John Paul II: Christafidelis Laici
Lumen Gentium Ch. IV: The Laity
Matt and Dan (yes, the Asians) go full Catholic and talk about Mary, “the tigerest of tiger mums”. The one who said “yes” to God with the kind of fierce loyalty that only an Asian mum could pull off. They dive into how Mary's fiat isn't just a theological yes, it’s the ultimate immigrant mum move: sacrificial, strategic, and quietly revolutionary.
From knockoff Marian statues in Chinatown shrines to Our Lady rocking hanfu, we unpack how Mary becomes a cultural chameleon, enfleshing the Gospel in a thousand tongues and ten thousand images.
They also chop through some of the bad theology out there: no, Mary isn't the fourth person of the Trinity. Yes, she matters deeply in salvation history. And yes, Protestant friends, you can talk about her without spontaneously combusting.
In the end, we find that Mary is the kind of figure who doesn't just belong in Catholic kitsch or incense-soaked altars - she offers Good News to all Christians. With tiger stripes and tenderness, Mary mothers us into mystery.
Resources
Dicastry for Promoting Christian Unity: Mary - Grace and Hope in Christ
Matt and Dan are back at it again — stir-frying their brains in the theological wok of suffering.
This week, they dig deeper into Pope John Paul II’s Salvifici Doloris, a document with more spiritual depth than your Ah Ma’s silent judgment. Why do humans not just suffer, but also spiral into deep thoughts about suffering? Is this a grace, or just another form of divine trolling?
Matt and Dan chew over how pain forces us to ask life’s big, messy questions — like char kway teow: greasy, satisfying, but maybe a little too real at 2am. And here's the kicker - suffering, when seen through Christ, isn’t just a pit of despair; it becomes part of our salvation.
So, grab a plate, bring your chilli oil, and join these two Awkward Asian Theologians as they sweat through the divine mystery of pain - one existential noodle strand at a time.
Resources:
John Paul II: Salvifici Doloris
It’s September which, as every Chinese auntie knows, means ghost month is over but the suffering of the long year has just begun.
In this episode, Matt and Dan slip into the bitter oolong of theological reflection and sip slowly on the paradox of suffering: the kind that doesn’t go away when you pray harder, and the kind that doesn’t get prettier when you quote Romans 8 at it.
Framing the conversation between the minimisers, who deny the pangs in stoic detachment, and the maximisers, who build Chinese altars to their affliction, we look at suffering as an inevitable and indispensable dimension of the Christian journey. What does Christ’s victory on the cross actually do with our pain – and what does it very much not do?
Matt and Dan warn the Christian against making a fetish of suffering or pretending it doesn't exist at all. Instead, they suggest something stranger and more relational: suffering as a place of encounter. A furnace, yes, but one where another stands with you.
So boil your tea, light your incense, and prepare to get awkward. Suffering is on the table in this double episode bonanza, and maybe, just maybe, grace is hiding in the steam.
Resources
John Paul II: Salvifici Doloris
Welcome to Awkward Asian Theologians, where Matt and Dan embark on their most swoon-worthy, heart-fluttering episode yet - a theological deep dive into love.
They unpack why a band called Foreigner penned the immortal anthem “I Want to Know What Love Is” - because, spoiler alert, someone else might just have a better grip on love than we do. But beyond the catchy chorus and cheesy 80s power ballads, Matt and Dan plunge headfirst into the depths of Benedict XVI’s Deus Caritas Est — his first encyclical, the love letter to love itself.
They’ll swirl through the poetic Chinese brushstrokes ofecstasy, eros and agape, revealing how divine love is essentially ecstatic in structure, a dance that lifts us beyond ourselves like a kite caught in a sudden breeze over a lotus pond. This ecstatic love is not just heavenly fluff; it’s the blueprint for how Christians should love, in a way that embraces paradox and mystery.
So, get ready for a journey that’s equal parts romance and theology, awkward confessions and ecstatic revelations. Because how we understand love — or fail to — shapes the very way we follow Jesus and live as disciples in this messy, beautiful world.
Resources
Benedict XVI: Deus Caritas Est
John Paul II: Redemptor Hominis
Matt and Dan sit down with a pot of oolong and a question: What happens when people move – and the Church moves with them?
In this episode, they poke around the tangled roots between migration and the makeup of the global and local Church. Like a bamboo grove shaped by wind and soil, the Church grows along the fault lines of human movement, and it’s anything but static. They also untangle a very awkward knot: What does it mean to do things “Asianly” and do things “Christianly”? Are these two different tea leaves, or the same leaves steeped in different water?
From shifting migration trends to the ache of nostalgia and the theology of loss (because Auntie’s dumplings are gone and so is the neighbourhood church), they reflect on how migrant Christians carry faith not just in their luggage, but in their longing. All this while trying to avoid getting trapped in the usual political hotpot.
No easy soundbites here. Just some awkward theology with a side of rice.
Resources
Pew Research Center: The Religious Composition of the World’s Migrants
Catholic Voice: It's All in the Numbers
Matt and Dan kick things off by casually showing off their wristwear, channelling peak Asian salaryman energy, before limping valiantly into the Church’s missionary posture (not that posture, you degenerate).
Along the way, they acknowledge the burnout risk faced by missionaries, like it’s Lunar New Year and they’re the last firecracker still sparking. In a move bound to disappoint the ancestors, they float a spicy proposition: maybe mission isn’t just about divine task completion and unquestioning obedience. Maybe faith is more than duty. They even dare to talk about love and relationships, concepts completely foreign to the Asian, toasting the joy of divine filiation with a schooner of Yakult.
Resources
Opus Dei: What is Divine Filiation
For Watches: Lemonsha in Ginza
Matt and Dan go meta, like two lost dumplings floating in a bowl of hot broth, trying to figure out what it means to do things “Asianly.”
They untangle the knots of representation and the elusive “Asian standpoint”, confess to using a smorgasbord of labels - the made-up tags that others love to slap on them - and wonder: could we swap these out for something purely Asian? Maybe a porcelain teapot? Or a bamboo shoot?
Somewhere in the chaos, they explore the theological weight of navigating these sticky, pre-packaged labels and how it all messes with Christian identity when divine evelation insists on being bigger than any box we try to squeeze it into.
Resources
Peter C Phan: Asian Christianities
Matt and Dan kick off the new season by going full ying-yang – back to the basics. And by basics, we mean Jesus.
That’s right: before we talk Resurrection, redemption, or rewatching Wong Kar-wai films for spiritual insight, we’re starting at the source.
Who is Jesus? What’s up with his name? And why does it matter that he’s both God and human, king and servant, fully divine and yet creating awkwardness at first century dinner parties?
Related to this, the Asians grapple with the beautiful, frustrating paradox at the heart of Christian faith: the coexistence of objective truth with subjective experience and culture. Should the Gospel come with a side of hot pot?
Along the way, Matt has a spiritual flashback to his younger, more foolish theology days where he found unexpected Christological wisdom in reruns of The Golden Girls. Dan, as always, keeps things grounded, wielding paradox like a wok and frying up some tasty insights on Jesus, the Asian Way.
Resources
John Paul II: Salvifici Doloris
Graham Ward: Christ & Culture
Henri de Lubac: The Church
In this second instalment of the two-part meditation on faith, Matt and Dan move from Asia’s unique spiritual terrain toward a more universal grammar of belief.
Defying the expectations of tiger mums, they explore faith not as a possession or passport, but as a living rhythm—more pilgrimage than property.
Along the way, they challenge some sticky assumptions: that faith is an identity badge, a doctrinal treasure chest, or a battleground of truth claims.
They also sit with the Church’s role as a kind of guardian - both temple gatekeeper and maternal presence - preserving the sacred ember of faith amid the flux of ages, East and West.
Alain Badiou: St Paul - The Foundations of Universalism
Our most Asian episode yet!
Matt extols the hidden mystery of Australian country Chinese cuisine, while Dan riffs on the situation of Christians across Asia. He debunks the myth that Christian faith in the region has simply been a proxy for colonialism or a late addition to the Chinese religious menu.
They end by asking what it means to be fully Christian and fully Asian, concluding it is an increasing urgent question for Asians and non-Asians (and likely has something to do with steaming fish).
Daniel Ang: Bearing Witness in Asia
Matt and Dan light a joss stick for the ancestors and crack open a very special (and slightly spicy) episode of Awkward Asian Theologians - this time, in memory of the dearly departed Pope Francis. Yes, the Argentinian Pope who said “Pachamama” out loud in the Vatican and lived to tell the tale.
They reflect on a papacy that was as chaotically beautiful as your auntie's home altar: a bit cluttered, deeply sincere, occasionally controversial, and full of incendiary content. Matt takes a detour into the legacy of Luigi Giussani - no, not a K-drama villain, but close - while Dan channels the virtue of presence, something Pope Francis quietly re-centred in the Catholic tradition. Like the yum cha trolley that shows up with you need it most, this special episode of Awkward Asian Theologians is steaming hot and smells of the sheep.
Resources
Pope Francis: Evangelii Gaudium
Daniel Ang: Spiritual Director of the Universal Church
This is the second installment of a two-parter on the theme of mystery.
Matt and Dan use more big words to talk about how divine mystery makes itself incarnate into our experience. They also talk about how Christian grappling of divine mystery should lead to a certain posture, one that brings us to our knees rather than inflates our heads.
Look out for the use of the term "sacramental ontology".
Matt and Dan begin a two-parter on what mystery is and entails.
They use big words like "epistemology", and warn us about the risk of reducing mystery to a jingoistic stopping of further reflection on the life of faith.
They also warn us about the conceit of thinking one's way to salvation, instead of truly encountering the complexity of reality and God's working his way through our lived experience.
Graham Ward: The Unimaginable
Pope Francis: Address to Participants in the International Congress on the Future of Theology
Matt and Dan talk about the finer details of asian dinner conversations, before speaking about the Christian task of evangelisation.
They clarify the important distinction between evangelisation and "flexing" (and why one does not equate with the other). They also talk about the link between parish life and the imperative for evangelisation, and the important place of divine gift, journeying and communion in the proclamation of the Gospel.
Pope Francis, Evangelii Gaudium
In this episode, Matt confesses to being a sedevacantist, discusses with Dan why Catholic tradition matters, and how it can be the cause of maximum emotional damage for the Asian. They also look at change and faithfulness, engaging the analogy of the body.
Second Vatican Council:Dei Verbum (esp 7-9)
Anne Carpenter’s article onMaurice Blondel & the Fights Over Catholic Tradition.
In this episode, Matt and Dan talk about the sacraments, try not to offend Profestants (and like good Asians, fail), and ponder if mere culture can save us (Spoiler: it can't).
They also look at why evangelisation matters, involves each of us and why Asians make parishes complex.
Matt and Dan discuss what to order at Yum Cha. They also speak of other things good, true and beautiful, jumping off their previous episode on Theology and focusing on the spiritual life of parishes, the fundamental building block of most Catholics' spiritual lives.
They explain and speak of the centrality of missionary discipleship for the local community of faith, and in so doing, bust a big myth about what parishes are meant to do.
They also declare that Asians make bad hymns good, and demonstrate why Catholics should get off the sacramental treadmill, and challenge us all to do more than simply "get on with the program".
Divine Renovation Ministry: https://divinerenovation.org/
Catholic Archdiocese of Melbourne: Missionary Discipleship
In this episode, Dan incurs Matt's jealousy by discussing his favourite dim sum, and also laying claim to all things Asian.
They also discuss other steamy goods like theology. They define what it is, what it is not, and what good it does to us intellectually, pastorally and spiritually. They also discuss why Catholics (Asian or otherwise) should care and reflect theologically in order to better engage with the reality, time and space in which they live, as well as deepen their relationship with Jesus.
SPOILER ALERT: They also talk about why one cannot think their way to salvation.
Anthony Ferguson: Unbiased Reality
Leave your shoes at the door!
Matt and Dan introduce themselves, the podcast and, like good Asians, justify their own existence.
They also speak of the importance of history and mystery and introduce a special third guest.
Robert Imbelli: A Wondrous Adventure