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The Learning Curve
Pioneer Institute
322 episodes
5 days ago
Join The Learning Curve every Wednesday for insight and perspective on education, learning trends, school choice, and public policy. Our hosts and guests offer a mix of provocative commentary as they interview school leaders, innovators, bestselling authors, policymakers, and more. Send any suggestions, tips, and fan mail to pioneer@pioneerinstitute.org.

Listen to all episodes of The Learning Curve at Ricochet.com.
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Education
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All content for The Learning Curve is the property of Pioneer Institute and is served directly from their servers with no modification, redirects, or rehosting. The podcast is not affiliated with or endorsed by Podjoint in any way.
Join The Learning Curve every Wednesday for insight and perspective on education, learning trends, school choice, and public policy. Our hosts and guests offer a mix of provocative commentary as they interview school leaders, innovators, bestselling authors, policymakers, and more. Send any suggestions, tips, and fan mail to pioneer@pioneerinstitute.org.

Listen to all episodes of The Learning Curve at Ricochet.com.
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Education
Episodes (20/322)
The Learning Curve
Harvard’s Leo Damrosch on Robert Louis Stevenson & Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Great Hearts Academies’ Dr. Helen Baxendale interview Leo Damrosch, Ernest Bernbaum Professor of Literature Emeritus at Harvard University, and acclaimed biographer of some of the world's greatest literary figures. Prof. Damrosch discusses his newest book Storyteller: The Life of Robert Louis Stevenson. He reflects on Stevenson's childhood in Scotland and the close relationship he maintained with his nanny, Alison Cunningham. He shares how Stevenson lived an adventurous life, with his travel inspiring classics like Treasure Island, Kidnapped, and A Child’s Garden of Verses. Prof. Damrosch explores the moral dualities in Stevenson’s gothic masterpiece, Strange Case of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde, examining how the novella reveals humanity’s capacity for good and evil. He also discusses Stevenson’s later years in Samoa, his marriage to the American Fanny Osbourne, and his involvement with the politics and people of the South Pacific islands before dying at the age of 44. Prof. Damrosch concludes with reading an excerpt from Treasure Island.
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5 days ago
41 minutes

The Learning Curve
Stanford's Anna Lembke, MD, on Dopamine Nation & Addiction
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Center for Public Schools’ Alisha Searcy interview Dr. Anna Lembke, MD, professor of psychiatry at the Stanford University School of Medicine, chief of the Stanford Addiction Medicine Dual Diagnosis Clinic, and author of the NYT bestselling book, Dopamine Nation: Finding Balance in the Age of Indulgence. Dr. Lembke explains how dopamine functions in the human brain and contributes to addictive behaviors. She explores how modern American life fuels a culture of addiction, drawing parallels between past waves of opioid and alcohol abuse and today’s dependence on the internet and smart phones. Dr. Lembke also examines how overuse of technology is influencing dopamine-driven addiction and contributing to rising rates of teen mental illness. Drawing on her extensive research, she offers practical strategies for people seeking to break addictive habits and be more restrained in using technology. Dr. Lembke concludes the interview by reading an excerpt from Dopamine Nation: Finding Balance in the Age of Indulgence, offering a valuable lesson on how individuals can find greater fulfillment by living a more balanced life without excessive dopamine.
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1 week ago
36 minutes

The Learning Curve
AZ Trinity Arch Prep's Jack Johnson Pannell on Educating Boys
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Center for Public Schools’ Alisha Searcy interview Jack Johnson Pannell, founder and head of Trinity Arch Preparatory School for Boys in Phoenix. Mr. Pannell discusses his career as an educational leader, including founding a nationally recognized charter school in Baltimore, and shares how his background in the liberal arts and law has informed his approach to schooling. He explores the enduring value of a liberal arts education, American studies, and legal reasoning in cultivating civic-minded, intellectually engaged students. Pannell also addresses the impact of educational fads like school-to-work programs, social-emotional learning, and 21st-century skills on academic achievement, noting the importance of grounding boys in rigorous, time-tested curricula. Drawing on his experience moderating the Teen Socrates program at the Aspen Institute, he shares strategies for engaging teen boys in meaningful academic and philosophical discussions. Finally, Pannell explains how Trinity Arch Prep uses choice options available in AZ to impart Christian faith and strong academics to develop young men of character, intellect, and civic purpose.
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2 weeks ago
45 minutes

The Learning Curve
U-Ark's Robert Maranto & BASIS Ed Texas' Sean Woytek on Academically Intensive Charter Schools
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Walter Blanks of the American Federation for Children interview Prof. Robert Maranto and Sean Woytek co-authors of the Education Next piece, “Why Academically Intensive Charter Schools Deserve Our Attention.” They explore how rigorous charter school networks like BASIS Ed have achieved exceptional outcomes and what their success can teach policymakers and educators nationwide about improving academic performance nationwide. Maranto and Woytek trace BASIS’s origins to 1998, when it opened with 56 students in Tuscon, Arizona. Today, the network operates 40 schools across five states, consistently ranking among the nation’s top performers. Despite these results, Maranto and Woytek note that “Academically Intensive Charter Schools” (AICS) remain largely overlooked, even as national reading and math scores continue to decline. They explain how AICS differ from specialized or “No Excuses” charter models by emphasizing broad, rigorous academics and high expectations for all students. Spending roughly $12,350 per student—far less than traditional public schools—AICS achieve remarkable academic outcomes and demonstrate strong accountability. Maranto and Woytek conclude by urging educators and policymakers to recognize, study, and replicate the AICS model to expand access to high-quality, academically rigorous education across the country.
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3 weeks ago
33 minutes

The Learning Curve
U-Ark's Randall Woods on John Quincy Adams - Statesman of the Early Republic
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Center for Public Schools’ Alisha Searcy interview Randall Woods, John A. Cooper Distinguished Professor of History at the University of Arkansas, and author of John Quincy Adams: A Man for the Whole People. Prof. Woods shares the life and career of American statesman John Quincy Adams, the “first son of the Republic,” whose upbringing in the household of John and Abigail Adams shaped his lifelong devotion to public service. He reflects on Adams’s early diplomatic triumphs, including the Treaty of Ghent and the Monroe Doctrine, as well as the 1824 election that resulted in him becoming the sixth U.S. President. Prof. Woods describes the highlights of Adams’s congressional career—his leadership in overturning the “gag rule” on antislavery petitions and his powerful U.S. Supreme Court defense of the Amistad Africans' revolt at sea — before turning to the significance of his voluminous diaries in guiding future generations of the Adams family and American public servants. Woods concludes the interview by reading a favorite passage from his biography, John Quincy Adams: A Man for the Whole People.
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1 month ago
39 minutes

The Learning Curve
FEE's Kerry McDonald on Joyful Learning, Microschools, & Homeschooling
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and the Center for Public Schools’ Alisha Searcy interview Kerry McDonald, Senior Education Fellow at the Foundation for Economic Education (FEE), host of the LiberatED podcast, and author of Joyful Learning: How to Find Freedom, Happiness, and Success Beyond Conventional Schooling (2025). As a leading advocate for alternative schooling, McDonald shares how her educational background shaped her philosophy of learner-driven schooling and traces the history of homeschooling in America, highlighting the hurdles families have overcome in recent years. She reflects on the COVID-19 shutdowns that placed more than 50 million students into “Zoom school,” discussing lessons from that period and the ongoing problem of learning loss. McDonald concludes the interview examining the expansion of school choice programs in more than 20 states, weighing taxpayer costs and potential positive impact on students’ academic performance.
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1 month ago
40 minutes

The Learning Curve
Dr. Gil Troy on Theodor Herzl - Father of Zionism & Combating Antisemitism
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Eos Foundation’s Andrea Silbert interview Dr. Gil Troy, senior fellow at the Jewish People Policy Institute, Distinguished Scholar in North American History at McGill University, and editor of Theodor Herzl: The Collected Zionist Writings and Addresses of Israel's Founder. He offers an overview of Herzl’s upbringing in 19th-century Vienna, the antisemitic events that shaped his worldview, and how the infamous Dreyfus Affair spurred his determination to establish a Jewish State. Dr. Troy highlights Herzl’s most influential works, including The Jewish State and the Old New Land, and explained how they bolstered support for the Zionist movement. He also reflects on Herzl’s role in creating the First Zionist Congress and his impact as the “spiritual father of the Jewish State,” addressing how his influence continues to confront rising global antisemitism today. Dr. Troy concludes the interview with a reading from Theodor Herzl: The Collected Zionist Writings and Addresses of Israel's Founder.
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1 month ago
41 minutes

The Learning Curve
UK's Dr. Kathryn Hughes on George Eliot, Middlemarch, & Victorian Novels
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Great Hearts Academies’ Dr. Helen Baxendale interview Dr. Kathryn Hughes, academic historian and award-winning author of George Eliot: The Last Victorian. Dr. Hughes discusses the significance of 19th-century novelist Mary Ann Evans, better known by her pen name George Eliot, in shaping British literature and capturing the societal tensions of the Victorian era. She highlights Eliot’s formative years in rural Warwickshire, her intellectual and scandalous personal relationship with the philosopher George Henry Lewes, and how her unconventional experiences shaped her writing. Additionally, she delves into Eliot’s most celebrated works, including Adam Bede, Silas Marner, and Middlemarch. Dr. Hughes reflects on recurring themes of marriage, women’s roles, and political reform, solidifying her reputation as one of the greatest writers of the 19th century and ensuring her lasting impact on modern readers. She concludes the interview with an excerpt from her book, George Eliot: The Last Victorian.
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1 month ago
54 minutes

The Learning Curve
Florida's John Kirtley on School Choice
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and American Federation for Children Senior Fellow Shaka Mitchell interview John Kirtley, Managing Partner and co-founder of Keswick Partners, and founder and Chairman of Step Up For Students, a nonprofit that manages Florida’s state-funded K-12 scholarship programs serving over half a million students. Kirtley shares his journey from the private sector into education reform in the late 1990s, and why business leaders must actively engage in shaping K-12 policy. He reflects on Florida’s steady, incremental expansion of school choice programs, explaining how this long-term approach built a critical mass of school choice families despite longstanding opposition, and offers lessons for newer ESA states like Arizona, Texas, and Iowa that seek to accelerate growth. Mr. Kirtley addresses challenges ahead, from ensuring a strong supply of high-quality private schools to managing the complexities of universal ESA programs. He also discusses how to measure and maintain accountability in parent-driven school choice programs, strategies to reverse stagnating NAEP scores, and the opportunities presented by the new federal education tax credit program.
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2 months ago
53 minutes

The Learning Curve
NYT Bestseller Jane Leavy on Reforming Major League Baseball
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Pioneer Senior Fellow Charlie Chieppo interview award-winning journalist and New York Times bestselling author Jane Leavy. Ms. Leavy discusses her lifelong love of baseball, and her forthcoming book, Make Me Commissioner: I Know What’s Wrong with Baseball and How to Fix It, which comes out in September. She reflects on the magic of the Cape Cod Baseball League, contrasting it with today’s Major League Baseball, and explores the commissioner’s role since the tenure of Bart Giamatti in the 1980s. Leavy examines how labor disputes, steroid scandals, and the rise of Big Data have reshaped the game, fueling declining popularity, unprecedented pitcher injuries, and frustration among fans and Hall of Famers alike. At the same time, she highlights ways in which analytics have boosted performance at cutting-edge training centers like Driveline in Washington State. She shares candid insights on MLB Commissioner Rob Manfred’s media ambitions, the sport’s future, and her vision for restoring baseball’s timeless beauty. In closing, Ms. Leavy reads a passage from her book, Make Me Commissioner: I Know What’s Wrong with Baseball and How to Fix It.
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2 months ago
56 minutes

The Learning Curve
BU Law's Keith Hylton on Intellectual Property, Patents, & the Law
This week on The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Ret. MN Supreme Court Justice Barry Anderson interview Prof. Keith Hylton, William Fairfield Warren Distinguished Professor and Professor of Law at Boston University. Prof. Hylton shares insights from his academic career and the book Laws of Creation: Property Rights in the World of Ideas, which he co-authored. The discussion explores how Enlightenment thinkers like John Locke and Adam Smith helped shape the legal framework for property rights and the free market in the U.S., and how these ideas are central to understanding our modern economy. Prof. Hylton explains the constitutional foundations of American intellectual property (IP) law, Thomas Jefferson’s role in establishing the U.S. Patent Office, and how historic inventors like Thomas Edison exemplify American experimentation, innovation, and economic dynamism.  He also covers trade secrets, copyright law, and the tension between protecting inventors' individual patent rights and today’s calls for free access to copyrighted online content. Hylton addresses global challenges, including cyber theft and piracy, and reflects on key legal cases that define international IP enforcement. Prof. Hylton also shares three major takeaways he hopes high school and undergraduate students will understand about the importance of intellectual property rights in sustaining American rule of law, innovation, and economic growth. He concludes with a reading from his book, Laws of Creation: Property Rights in the World of Ideas.
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2 months ago
47 minutes

The Learning Curve
Pepperdine Law's Pulitzer Winner Edward Larson on 100th Anniv. of Scopes Monkey Trial
This week on The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Ret. MN Supreme Court Justice Barry Anderson interview Pulitzer Prize-winning historian and Pepperdine Law’s, Prof. Edward Larson. Prof. Larson marks the 100th anniversary of the Scopes “Monkey Trial,” a landmark case in America’s long-running debate over science, religion, and public education. Drawing on his acclaimed book Summer for the Gods, Prof. Larson provides historical context for the trial, which centered on high school teacher John Scopes, charged with violating Tennessee’s Butler Act against teaching evolution. Larson explores the cultural tensions of the 1920s—religious fundamentalism, immigration, and rapid social change—that set the stage for the courtroom showdown between famed attorneys Clarence Darrow and William Jennings Bryan. He describes the media frenzy, the dramatic legal arguments, and the trial’s verdict, offering insights into how the case became a defining moment in American civic life. He highlights the ongoing role of public schools, the enduring clash between modern science and religious belief, and the trial’s lasting legacy. Prof. Larson closes the interview with a reading from Summer for the Gods.
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2 months ago
55 minutes

The Learning Curve
Alisha Searcy on Center for Strong Public Schools
This week on The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Dr. Helen Baxendale of Great Hearts Academies interview longtime public education champion and Learning Curve co-host Alisha Searcy. Alisha joins the show as a guest to share her story and insights into K-12 public education reform. Herself a product of public-school choice, she discusses how those early experiences shaped her belief in accessible, high‑quality schooling for all students. Elected to the Georgia House at age 23, Alisha spent six terms crafting key education reform laws and policies, including the intradistrict transfer law and the charter school authorizer amendment, that sought to put students at the center of school reform efforts. She then transitioned into school leadership, serving as superintendent of a network of charter public schools in metro Atlanta, where she led dramatic academic improvement and operational turnaround. Drawing on both her legislative and schoolhouse experience, Alisha now leads an ambitious effort like Center for Strong Public Schools (CSPS) and CSPS Action, to support center-left state policymakers in navigating education challenges and designing student‑first public schools. In closing, she explains why the current moment presents unique opportunities to strengthen K-12 public education, especially in Southern states that are facing both pressing achievement needs and prospective school innovations.
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2 months ago
47 minutes

The Learning Curve
U-MD's Vincent Carretta on Phillis Wheatley Peters, Slavery, & Poetry
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts Alisha Searcy and U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng interview University of Maryland Emeritus Professor of English Vincent Carretta. Prof. Carretta explores the extraordinary life and enduring legacy of the first African-American to publish a book of poetry in English, Phillis Wheatley Peters. He offers insight into Phillis’ early life in West Africa, her transatlantic voyage aboard the slave ship Phillis, and her arrival in Boston in 1761. He discusses her enslavement by the Wheatley family, her exposure to Christianity during the Great Awakening, and her exceptional education in classical literature. Additionally, Prof. Carretta highlights how her poetry drew upon timeless poets like Homer, Virgil, Milton, and Pope, and how her first published works reflected themes of piety, imagination, and liberty. He concludes the interview with a reading of a passage from his book, Phillis Wheatley Peters: Biography of a Genius in Bondage.
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3 months ago
59 minutes

The Learning Curve
DFI's Jim Blew on Federal Education Tax Credit Program
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts Alisha Searcy and Dr. Cara Candal of ExcelinEd interview former assistant secretary at the U.S. Department of Education and co-founder of the Defense of Freedom Institute (DFI), Jim Blew. Mr. Blew reflects on his tenure in federal education leadership and his motivation for establishing DFI. He discusses the decades of rising federal K-12 spending through initiatives like RTTT, ESSA, and ESSER funds, instead calling for devolving federal authority out of the U.S. Department of Education, and more private school choice and charter public school innovation. Mr. Blew shares the origins and goals of the new national education tax credit law, which emphasizes private school choice options and state-level flexibility. He unpacks the program’s key provisions, including tax credits for donations to scholarship granting organizations (SGOs) that fund school choice for students. However, he raises concerns that the law’s state “opt-in” requirement may sideline students in blue states led by school choice opponents. Finally, Mr. Blew addresses some constitutional and strategic concerns, arguing that federal education tax credits, if carefully structured, can enhance educational opportunity.
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3 months ago
41 minutes

The Learning Curve
UK's Dr. Juliet Barker on the Brontë Sisters & Classic Novels
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts Alisha Searcy and Helen Baxendale of Great Hearts Academies interview award-winning English historian and biographer, Dr. Juliet Barker. She offers a rich portrait of the Brontë family, whose timeless contributions have widely impacted English literature and fiction writing. Dr. Barker explores the formative influences of their father, Patrick Brontë, an Irish Anglican minister with deep intellectual, religious, and educational convictions that shaped his family's writing, and their tight-knit, creative environment in Haworth that inspired his gifted literary daughters Charlotte, Emily, and Anne. She delves into Charlotte’s drive for self-improvement, the enduring power of her novel Jane Eyre, and its themes of independence, love, and social criticism. Dr. Barker discusses Emily’s affection for nature, reclusive personality, and the intense emotional landscape of her novel, Wuthering Heights. She also explores Anne’s gentle, strong-willed temperament, her novels Agnes Grey and The Tenant of Wildfell Hall, and their groundbreaking critiques of women's prescribed roles and the hypocrisies of 19th-century society. Dr. Barker shares insights about the tragic deaths of all six Brontë siblings, including Branwell, the family’s son. She concludes the interview by discussing the sisters’ lasting legacy as great literary women who revolutionized Victorian fiction and whose works continue to resonate with modern readers across the globe. In...
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3 months ago
51 minutes

The Learning Curve
Blackstone Valley's Dr. Michael Fitzpatrick on MA's Nation-Leading Voc-Techs
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng and Walter Blanks interview Dr. Michael Fitzpatrick, who has served as superintendent-director of the Blackstone Valley Vocational Regional School District since 1994. A leader in vocational-technical education, Dr. Fitzpatrick reflects on his own educational journey and offers insights into leadership that puts students first. He discusses how Massachusetts’ voc-tech schools used the 1993 Education Reform Act’s accountability tools like MCAS, standards, and school choice, to drive achievement, particularly for students with diverse learning needs. He shares how Valley Tech and other voc-techs built a nationally recognized culture that seamlessly integrates academics and occupational training, resulting in low dropout rates and success in national skills competitions. Dr. Fitzpatrick also delves into the critical partnerships among industry, organized labor, and higher education that have fueled reform. He addresses current policy debates over voc-tech admissions and recruitment practices, and how the voc-tech community has responded. Finally, he offers three key policy recommendations to strengthen vocational-technical education across the country, drawing on decades of hands-on leadership and reform experience.
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3 months ago
35 minutes

The Learning Curve
Stanford's Pulitzer Winner Jack Rakove on American Independence
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts Alisha Searcy and Massachusetts civics teacher Kelley Brown interview Pulitzer Prize-winning historian Jack Rakove, Coe Professor Emeritus at Stanford University. Prof. Rakove explores the origins of the American Revolution and U.S. Constitution through the lives of the nation’s Founding Era figures. Reflecting on young John Adams’ vivid depiction of his schoolhouse in colonial Massachusetts, Rakove offers context for the political and social landscape of the 18th-century America. He discusses the central constitutional dispute between the British Parliament and the American colonies over political authority, which escalated after the Stamp Act crisis and the Boston Tea Party. Prof. Rakove traces the emergence of the Continental Congress as a revolutionary governing body and its role in declaring independence. He also shares the moral contradictions of liberty in a society dependent on slavery and explains how internal debates over slavery shaped politics within the Continental Congress. Additionally, Prof. Rakove highlights the contributions of Alexander Hamilton and James Madison in building a durable federal constitutional system and explains Madison’s critical role in drafting the Bill of Rights. He closes with a reading from Revolutionaries: A New History of the Invention of America.
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4 months ago
1 hour 21 minutes

The Learning Curve
Ian Rowe & Steven Wilson on The Lost Decade
In this special episode of The Learning Curve, guest co-host Ian Rowe interviews Steven Wilson, a senior fellow at Pioneer Institute and founder of the Ascend Charter Network. Their discussion centers on Wilson's new book, The Lost Decade, which concerns education's shift away from liberal arts and toward social justice ideology and anti-intellectualism. They examine the impact of this shift on student achievement, highlight successful education models such as classical schools and virtues-based curricula, and stress the importance of maintaining high academic standards. Wilson also touches on the classical learning test as a promising alternative to current, politicized assessments. Wilson and Rowe conclude with a call to focus on truth, knowledge, and honor in education to empower all students.
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4 months ago
42 minutes

The Learning Curve
Brandeis Uni.'s John Burt on Robert Penn Warren & All the King's Men
In this week’s episode of The Learning Curve, co-hosts Alisha Searcy and U-Arkansas Prof. Albert Cheng interview John Burt, the Paul Prosswimmer Professor of American Literature at Brandeis University. Prof. Burt offers rich insight into the life and work of one of the 20th century’s greatest American writers, Robert Penn Warren. Raised in rural southwestern Kentucky, Warren was deeply shaped by the legacy of the Civil War, which he explored in his influential 1961 work, The Legacy of the Civil War, and throughout his poetry and fiction. Prof. Burt shares that as a young man at Vanderbilt, Warren was influenced by the “Fugitives” literary group and contributed to I’ll Take My Stand: The South and the Agrarian Tradition, a decision he later deeply regretted. His Pulitzer-winning novel All the King’s Men follows the rise and fall of populist governor Willie Stark, modeled in part on Huey Long and Julius Caesar, through the eyes of journalist Jack Burden, whose personal and philosophical journey mirrors Stark’s. Prof. Burt shares that the novel wrestles with the limits of knowledge and the weight of moral responsibility, culminating in a powerful meditation on time, history, and the human condition.
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4 months ago
51 minutes

The Learning Curve
Join The Learning Curve every Wednesday for insight and perspective on education, learning trends, school choice, and public policy. Our hosts and guests offer a mix of provocative commentary as they interview school leaders, innovators, bestselling authors, policymakers, and more. Send any suggestions, tips, and fan mail to pioneer@pioneerinstitute.org.

Listen to all episodes of The Learning Curve at Ricochet.com.