Jonathan and Jeff are finally back with a conversation that picks up the threads that were left in the previous episode's topics of Daoist philosophy and technology. Jeff asks Jon if he's seen Spirited Away and tries to make a connection without revealing too much (since as of the time of the recording, Jon had no seen it). They discuss their mutual friend Troy. Digging into their admittedly surface-level understanding of Daoism, they discuss some key themes as they relate to our desire and longing for a worthwhile existence. Jeff suggests there is an empathetic element to Bo Burnham's song about white women on Instagram that is connected to his deeper critique of technology. This leads to a brief inquiry into whether all comedians were nihilists or not -- they suggest that the late great Norm MacDonald did not seem to be. 

They circle back to the anarchic underpinnings of Daoist philosophy. They talk about the differences between morality and virtue (in the Daoist sense). They link the Daoist resistance to social norms to Nietzsche's concept of the Apollonian and the Dionysian. Jeff talks about the difference between Bacchus as exhuberance and fecundity (at least as he appears in the Narnian Universe) and Dionysius as destruction and death drive (at least as he appears in Nietzsche). Jon and Jeff bring up (and disagree about) the difference between an understanding of the Way as a kind of origin versus an understanding of it as a kind of ideal. Jeff reflects on the relation of anxiety and Lacanian psychoanalytical thought and the Daoist concept of the uncarved block. 

During the second half, they again debate whether the Way is about returning to an originary state of non-striving or whether it is about finding what is nourishing. They discuss the difference between dopamine hits (like if Troy likes one of Jeff's tweets) and true satisfaction or contentment. They return to the topic of technology and its positioning ideologically as a mechanism for freeing us from toil. They talk about the similarities and differences between Daoist and Christian thought. Jon talks about the disgusting way Dale Carnegie's book about winning friends has been used in the business world. Jeff asks about whether evolutionary thought is working to leave certain Victorian-era metaphors behind, and Jon talks about the role of reciprocity in nature and its relationship to the idea of contentment. Jeff finishes with the story of how he recently acquired a stack of books on eastern philosophy (and some other stuff).

Got something to say? Email us at subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com

Show Notes

Tao Te Ching, by Lao Tzu

Taoism: The Parting of the Way, by Holmes Welch Jr.

Spirited Away (Film)

"White Woman's Instagram" by Bo Burnham

Mythos, by Stephen Fry

The Birth of Tragedy, by Friedrich Nietzsche

Prince Caspian, by C.S. Lewis

Happiness is Not a Fish You Can Catch, by Our Lady Peace

How to Win Friends and Influence People, by Dale Carnegie

10,000 Dreams Interpreted

Music 

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay 

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

Jonathan and Jeff continue their discussion of technology and the dilemma of how technology makes things easier, which simultaneously undermines the activities that lead to meaning (e.g., habit-building, etc.). Building off of Alan Jacobs's essay that we raised last time, they discuss the Hong Kong-Berlin philosopher, Yuk Hui, and his idea of cosmotechnics. They discuss the nefarious efforts of technology to capitalize on our fascination with The New; the history of Diet Coke (it's related to Newness); James K.A. Smith, his "cultural liturgies" series, and the centrality of habit-building to the human experience; the sources of our comfort foods; the role of being persistently committed to the mundane; the relationship between habits and the contextual webs that promote or undermine their formation; where does meaning come from and exist; tips on how to navigate complicated books (tl;dr: read a review!); they go into detail about Yuk Hui's initial argument in The Question Concerning Technology, including the role of the Promethean myth in the development of the Western cosmotechnic; how our worldview are shaped by stories, our communities, and other things; whether it's even possible to tell or submit to new stories that shape our orientation to the world; the possibility (or lack thereof) of converting to Eastern Orthodox theology; the way our communities shape our eschatologies; Jeff tries out his Rob Bell impersonation and also riffs on a potential "business fiction" idea; driving fast on the autobahn; the work Chile is doing on its new constitution; Ratatouille; the scandal of particularity vs novelty; Yuk Hui's "new understanding of history"; the inner lives of wolves — with a quick side discussion on Timothy Morton's hyperobjects; and Jeff teases an amazing story about an encounter with the Dao that you’ll only be able to hear if you listen to the next episode! If you would like to send us a note, email us at subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com. Show Notes Alan Jacobs, "From Tech Critique to Ways of Living," The New Atlantis: https://www.thenewatlantis.com/publications/from-tech-critique-to-ways-of-living James K.A. Smith, You Are What You Love Yann Martel, Life of Pi Yuk Hui, The Question Concerning Technology in China Martin Heidegger, The Question Concerning Technology Rick Riordan, The Lightning Thief Mary Shelley, Frankenstein C.S. Lewis, The Great Divorce The Heretic (Documentary): https://www.imdb.com/title/tt7174366/ John Green, Turtles All the Way Down Music Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

Jeff and Jonathan open this next episode in their miniseries on technology by talking about an article by Alan Jacobs that recently appeared in The New Atlantis. The subtitle of this article is: "Neil Postman was right. So what?" Is there a way beyond critique, without losing the true and accurate observations of Postman and others? Jonathan mentions the dark place the technology question has led him to, citing Nietzsche's adage: "the measure of a person is how much truth they can handle." They discuss — and don’t always agree on! — how the valid instrumentalities of the past have given way to a world of "standing reserve." Is it possible to introduce new technologies? What counts as "meaningful"? What is meaning even? They talk about the value of having a friend who can play the theremin, the ongoing prescience of Fern Gully, the value of having a friend who knows how to make a fire (thank you to Jeff’s neighbour!), Owen Barfield’s idea of the evolution of consciousness, Bruderhof communes, the aversion of much of academic culture to conviviality and family, the story of people trying to push so-called “technological advances” on cultures without accounting for that culture’s embeddedness within its existing context. Jeff also gets a scatological Bible story way wrong (i.e., Ezekiel doesn't eat it; he cooks over it — but it does not belong to a dog [Ezekiel 4:12-17]). Want to add your two cents? Email us as subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com Show Notes Alan Jacobs, "From Tech Critique to Ways of Living," The New Atlantis: https://www.thenewatlantis.com/publications/from-tech-critique-to-ways-of-living George Stuart, The Wheelwright's Shop, https://archive.org/details/wheelwrights-shop/mode/2up Owen Barfield, Saving the Appearances: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saving_the_Appearances Andrew Skabelund, "The Gods of Academia: Child Sacrifice in the Ivory Tower," Plough Quarterly: https://www.plough.com/en/topics/life/work/the-gods-of-academia Yuk Hui, Hong Kong-Berlin philosopher: https://twitter.com/digital_objects Music Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

Jeff and Jonathan are back with season two of Subjects in Process. Starting off with a series on technology, in this first half of the episode, Jeff and Jonathan attempt to summarize what they think they know, their sources and where they are coming from, and what questions they want to investigate about what Martin Heidegger called “the question concerning technology”. In the second half of the episode – recorded two weeks later – they go into more of their assumptions and lay the groundwork to discuss some shifts in their thinking. Jonathan describes his expectation of discussing the catch-22 of either being carried along by the forces of tech or the blunders of overseeing the impossible task of attempting to confront this and comprehensively design the world, and how he has shifted to considering alternatives beyond this potentially false dilemma. The discussion touches on Albert Borgmann (allegedly not an cyborg); how tech changes birthday parties; the power and limits of tech as revealed by old school and new school computer chess engines; Zeynep Tufekci and the challenges of resulting from too much information; Martin Heidegger and “standing reserve,” or the modern tendency to see the world as merely resource; tech companies “bio-hacking” customers through data and dopamine; the wonders of nerding out; what changes in a fast-changing society; how tech can cut us off from the world; Wendell Berry and the possibilities of resisting tech; transparency of technology and how that impacts human freedom; Super AI and the pros and cons of both its potential failure or success; complexity in the world and the limitations of human understanding; early onset grumpiness and the risks of catastrophizing; addiction and dopamine hits for kids; the confusion of biological and information signals in the modern environment; Nicholas Carr, “The Shallows,” and tech’s impact on our attention span; substantive, instrumentalist, and pluralist views on technology; therapy robots and the tragedy of their potential effectiveness; approaches to combating drug addiction; and if we can preserve what is good and empower individual decision-making.

In this final episode of Season 01, Jonathan and Jeff wrap things up by establishing their definitive positions on all of the topics discussed over the previous 14 episodes. Just kidding! Instead, they reflect on what they discussed, what were the questions raised, and what contributed to the conversational paths they meandered along. They touch on the value of paying kids to do huge, non-utilitarian projects that they express interest in. They discuss the challenge of coming up with definitions and why a good definition can be so satisfying -- and how definitions can still carry the weight of our implicit biases. They talk about how exciting and interesting "big idea" books can be, and how they are probably also only 6% right (that number was of course mathematically deduced and can be wholly relied upon). They ask whether the words "saliva" and "salience" have a common root. (Postscript: They don't!). Jonathan introduces the important concept of "hard pants" -- a term which Jeff has used in work meetings since the recording of this episode.

During the second half of the show, they talk about the sorts of topics that they might be interested in discussing during Season 02. Some of the topics mentioned include: technology, myth and symbolism, sci-fi and fantasy, culture-making, and The Two Popes. Prior to reviewing these, Jon raises a few remaining questions he has about capitalism. This leads to a discussion about the centrality of "trust" to so many topics. Jeff and Jon talk about the subject of "culture" and what topics might come up under that category -- including sub-culture, media and entertainment, workplace culture, etc. Jeff goes on a slight rant about the impact of the winds of reality upon the boundaries of Christendom and how this is a good thing that has led to new possibilities. And they finish with some exploration of whether they have received any emails over the course of the season. (The jury is still out on this question.)

Speaking of which: if you would like to send us a note, email us at subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com. See you next season!

Show Notes:

• A Secular Age by Charles Taylor: https://www.hup.harvard.edu/catalog.php?isbn=9780674986916
• Sources of the Self by Charles Taylor: https://www.hup.harvard.edu/catalog.php?isbn=9780674824263
• The Human Condition by Hannah Arendt: https://press.uchicago.edu/ucp/books/book/chicago/H/bo29137972.html
• Podcast: "The Meaning of Life" from The Fundamentalists Podcast with Peter Rollins and Elliott Morgan (https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/the-meaning-of-life/id1346820645?i=1000515703145)
• After Virtue by Alasdair MacIntyre: https://undpress.nd.edu/9780268035044/after-virtue/
• A Canticle for Leibowitz by Walter M. Miller, Jr.: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/114888/a-canticle-for-leibowitz-by-walter-m-miller-jr/
• Movie: Raya and the Last Dragon (https://www.disneyplus.com/movies/raya-and-the-last-dragon/6dyengbx3iYK) 
• Dragonlance Chronicles (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragonlance_Chronicles)
• Christ and Culture by H. Richard Niebuhr: https://www.harpercollins.com/products/christ-and-culture-h-richard-niebuhr
• Podcast: "Left Behind 2014" from Good Christian Fun, feat. Griffin Newman (https://headgum.com/good-christian-fun/left-behind-2014-with-griffin-newman)

Music Notes:

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" Tim Moor on Pixabay

Jonathan and Jeff continue their discussion about the name of this very podcast by talking about the idea of the Subject, but not before trying to discern their apostolic succession to famous philosophers of the past. (It is a bit of a stretch, actually.) But once they get back on to that topic, they explore where philosophy gets the necessary kick in its pants to dig into the subject of the Subject, especially via the Masters of Suspicion (Marx, Freud, and Nietzsche). (The discussion of this term raises questions surrounding Paul Ricoeur's idea of the hermeneutics of suspicion vs the hermeneutics of generosity).

In the second half of the podcast, Jeff and Jonathan start to dig into some of Julia Kristeva's contributions to the Subject along with other psychoanalytical concepts, such as "the mirror stage," Lacan's typology of the Imaginary, the Symbolic, and the Real, Kristeva's idea of "the semiotic" and "the symbolic," and ultimately "the subject of enunciation" (that tries to explain and position itself in the world symbolically) and "the subject-in-process" (that is constantly being constrained and unable to express itself in its entirety clearly in language). They likely overly (and unfairly) merge Lacan's and Kristeva's thought, particularly with regards to the Real. As they slow their roll on this, though, they begin to ask whether it's absolutely necessary for the Real to be horrific, or whether the Real could be experienced as a miracle and how the Real might be a sign of hope. (Although they do not discuss Kristeva's idea of "abjection".)

Jeff and Jonathan also mull the following competition for listeners: Write a short story of 500 words or less that describes what happens when Martin Heidegger, Owen Barfield, and Jean-Paul Sartre look at a tree. (Hint: One of them pukes). Send your entries along (as well as any questions, comments, rants) to subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com.

Show Notes:

• The Argument and Action of Plato’s Laws by Leo Strauss (https://press.uchicago.edu/ucp/books/book/chicago/A/bo49994683.html)
• The Closing of the American Mind by Alan Bloom (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Closing_of_the_American_Mind)
• Deconstruction and the Remainders of Phenomenology by Tilottama Rajan (https://www.sup.org/books/title/?id=3636)
• Saving the Appearances by Owen Barfield (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saving_the_Appearances)
• Tool-Being by Graham Harman (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graham_Harman)
• Freud and Philosophy by Paul Ricoeur and the hermeneutics of suspicion (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeneutics_of_suspicion)
• Being Wrong by Kathryn Schulz (https://www.harpercollins.com/products/being-wrong-kathryn-schulz?variant=32123000487970) 
• Game: "The Evolution of Trust" (developed by Nicky Case): https://ncase.me/trust/
• Revolution in Poetic Language by Julia Kristeva (http://cup.columbia.edu/book/revolution-in-poetic-language/9780231056434)
• "The Mirror-Stage as Formative of the Function of the I as Revealed in Psychoanalytic Experience" by Jacques Lacan (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_stage; http://www.sholetteseminars.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/LacanMirrorPhase..pdf)
• The Birth of Tragedy by Friedrich Nietzsche and the ideas of "The Apollonian" vs "The Dionysian" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollonian_and_Dionysian)

Music Notes:

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" Tim Moor on Pixabay

Jeff and Jonathan switch gears in this episode to talk a bit about the context of the name of the podcast. Reflecting on the experience of being an English student and a Philosophy student, they talk through what they remember about literary and critical theory, before veering into a deep dive on the differences between and backgrounds of Continental and Analytical philosophy -- "One of them cares about Truth, whether or not it is interesting; the other cares about being interesting, whether or not it is True." Which is which? Find out in this episode! Although they do very nearly get to discussing the inspiration behind the podcast title by the absolute end of the episode (with a lot more about this topic coming in the next episode), the topic gives them the opportunity to discuss Hume's turn to sympathy, the Kantian Sublime, the Hegelian dialectic (and Jonathan's slam-dunk paraphrase of the master-slave dialectic and Jeff's not-very-convincing idea of the hippy-yuppy-hipster dialectic), the beauty of Nietzsche's writing and the problems with his moustache (and sister). Jeff reveals some (too many?) details about the parody novel he has been working on, tentatively titled: God's Not NOT Dead.  When they get to the 20th century, Jeff and Jon try to work through the connections between German philosophy and French philosophy/theory. They talk about the two crazy-smart Simones. And finally they explore the way the question of "The Subject" emerges in a unique way once philosophy, language, and psychology come into contact with each other. Want to correct us on anything, or offer Jeff a contract to film his parody novel? Email us at subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com Show Notes: The Emergence of Probability by Ian Hacking: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1446901.The_Emergence_of_Probability The Taming of Chance by Ian Hacking: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Taming_of_Chance Movie: God's Not Dead: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God%27s_Not_Dead_(film) Music Notes: Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay Intermission Music: "Uncut Gems" by Mezhdunami on Pixabay

In this final episode discussing Derek DelGaudio's In and Of Itself, Jonathan and Jeff talk about the difference between living to achieve something and living to be consistent, what it might mean to find deep satisfaction in life, and if living in the here-and-now and living an eternal kind of life are the same thing. They also talk about what shapes and makes us, and if stories and careful attention to the world, ourselves and what is true can transform and redeem our hurts and our failings.

The conversation ranges over several related (and some unrelated) issues, using DelGaudio's magic show as a springboard, including discussions on the internet, big-tech's attention-grabbing algorithms, whether we can build a better internet, whether we could have avoided the current one, and whether our future AI overlords will be friendly or not (and if either option is that great). Finally, they discuss how we relate to and know the world in such limited ways. Conversation on the wonder of all that is experienced and not yet fully known and also the possibility of only being aware of radically local comedians also crops up during this episode.

Show Notes:

• Derek DelGaudio's In and Of Itself: https://store.cineplex.com/Product/derek-delgaudios-in-of-itself
• On Evil by Terry Eagleton: https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300171259/evil
• "Invictus" (poem) by William Ernest Henley: https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/51642/invictus
• Movie: About Time: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/About_Time_(2013_film)
• Just a Minute by Wess Stafford: https://www.moodypublishers.com/just-a-minute/
• Blankets by Craig Thompson: https://drawnandquarterly.com/blankets
• Becoming Dallas Willard by Gary W. Moon: https://www.ivpress.com/becoming-dallas-willard
• The Divine Conspiracy by Dallas Willard: https://www.harpercollins.com/products/the-divine-conspiracy-dallas-willard
• Movie: A Hidden Life: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Hidden_Life_(2019_film)
• Movie: The Two Popes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Two_Popes
• Middlemarch by George Eliot: https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/145
• Podcast Episode: Radiolab – The Heartbeat: https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/segments/heartbeat

Music:

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

In this episode, Jeff and Jonathan continue their conversation about Derek DelGaudio’s In & Of Itself to talk about the power of being recognized, the generosity of inclusion, and how a new context can open us up to significant experiences. This includes some pondering of WandaVision, how children fit in our society, the impact of westernized, eastern religious practices in the workplace, and who’s more embarrassed by touchy feely stuff.  The conversation then turns to the significance of the unwritten future, the choices we make, what kind of a world we want to live in and what kind of people we want to be. This includes discussions of crossing paths with wild animals in the city, raising urban chickens, if our relationship with animals is inherently ethical, Steve Jobs and other idea stealers, Aslan and Chance the Rapper, and the nature of leadership.  Show Notes: "I Might Need Security" by Chance the Rapper: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZAc41N2QRU (Warning: Mature Language) "The Animal That Therefore I Am" by Jacques Derrida: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Animal_That_Therefore_I_Am Music: Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

Jonathan and Jeff continue their conversation on the philosophical magic show, Derek DelGaudio's In & Of Itself -- and this time they spend more than five minutes talking about it! While this episode doesn't contain spoilers from the show, we would highly recommend watching it first if you are able! This time around, they spend a lot more time talking about the show itself. They talk about Jeff's disappointment with magic shows in general and what that feeling might signal. Does it signal a deep desire to know the "in and of itself" of reality? What does it mean to want a deeper reality than the reality that you are stuck with? They talk about the difference between tricks versus magic, the love of fantasy novels (any Dragonlance fans out there still?), Jonathan's brilliant Junior High ping pong career, C.S. Lewis's friend Charles Williams' interest in real magic, Rosicrucians, miracles and magic and the unexplainable givenness of reality, and the Four Horsemen of the New Atheist Apocalypse (but mostly just Daniel Dennett and only briefly). Topics that are raised in DelGaudio's show trigger conversations about what it means to be part of a place and how this creates identity, what it means to "be told who you are" by others now vs. historically, and more. Jeff also talks about American Idol in a way that suggests he doesn't realize it hasn't been a current reference for several years.

Warning that there may be some small, brief spoilers about The Prestige, which is a movie that came out 15 years ago, so hopefully you've already seen it.

Show Notes:

• Derek DelGaudio's In and Of Itself: https://store.cineplex.com/Product/derek-delgaudios-in-of-itself
• "The Sorcerer's Apprentice" from Walt Disney's Fantasia
• "Waiting for a Miracle" by Yes Nice (about the artist Bas Jan Ader) 
• Consciousness Explained by Daniel Dennett: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consciousness_Explained
• The American Barbecue Showdown: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_American_Barbecue_Showdown
• The Hurt Locker: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hurt_Locker
• The Inoperative Community by Jean-Luc Nancy: https://www.upress.umn.edu/book-division/books/the-inoperative-community

Music:

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

After several episodes discussing more-or-less one subject, Jonathan and Jeff are moving on to something else! Maybe this really is subjects-in-progress after all!

Using Derek DelGaudio's philosophical magic show, In and Of Itself, as a springboard (and avoiding spoilers), Jonathan and Jeff walk through a very high-level history of philosophy (Heraclitus, Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, Nietzsche, and a sprinkling of others) and discuss the pursuit and discovery of meaning. The conversation is somewhat wide-ranging, briefly touching on an old band Jeff was in called Imitators of the Third Kind, the differences between "chair-ness" and "chairs," the Heraclitean leanings of Disney's Pocahontas, the Resurrection and "the scandal of particularity," the relation of the universal and the particular and its role in creating meaning, apophasis/cataphasis, and a strong closing recommendation to not be a Sophist (or at least not every day). Lots of stuff in the show notes on this one! 

Stay tuned for Jeff's movie pitch: "In a world where someone's trying to kill Socrates..." 

Show Notes: 

• Derek DelGaudio's In and Of Itself: https://store.cineplex.com/Product/derek-delgaudios-in-of-itself 
• The Incredible Burt Wonderstone: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0790628/ 
• Gerard Manley Hopkins, "That Nature is a Heraclitean Fire and of the Comfort of the Resurrection": https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/44397/that-nature-is-a-heraclitean-fire-and-of-the-comfort-of-the-resurrection 
• Ivan Illich, "The Scopic Past and the Ethics of the Gaze": http://www.davidtinapple.com/illich/1998_scopic_past.PDF 
• Madeleine L'Engle, A Wind in the Door: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Wind_in_the_Door 
• Annabel Lyon, The Golden Mean: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/104824/the-golden-mean-by-annabel-lyon/ 
• Viktor Frankel, Man's Search for Meaning: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man%27s_Search_for_Meaning 
• New cell imaging technology: https://youtu.be/9euW5iCjKDo 

Music: 

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay 

Intermission Music: Dan Henig, "Subway Dreams," YouTube Audio Library

In today’s episode, Jeff and Jonathan discuss if the economic concept of "barriers to entry" might be useful for articulating concerns beyond the market. The conversation considers if upbringing, access to capital, supportive relationships and community, or personal principles could be thought of as "barriers to entry" that should be considered when considering if markets are running fairly and effectively. 

They touch on statistical trends related to the concentration of wealth through history, whether a cow can be an anti-depressant, how the movie Barnyard describes real strength, and whether the musician Moby has Gregor's CDs. Finally, they discuss Herman Melville's short story, "Bartleby, the Scrivener," and consider if participation in the market is something we should even aim for. How should we think about and value people who can't, don't, or just don't want to participate in "economically productive" behaviour -- and what about those who would rather live by themselves in the mountains?

Want to chime in? Email us at: subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com

Show Notes:

• Lessons from Denmark about Inequality and Social Mobility: https://www.iza.org/publications/dp/14185/lessons-from-denmark-about-inequality-and-social-mobility
• Capital in the Twenty-First Century by Thomas Pikkety: https://www.hup.harvard.edu/catalog.php?isbn=9780674979857 (also a documentary on Netflix)
• Unpoverty: Rich Lessons from the Working Poor by Mark Lutz: https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/8888404-unpoverty
• Vox Conversations Podcast, Episode 123: "Is modern society making us depressed?" https://podcasts.apple.com/de/podcast/is-modern-society-making-us-depressed/id1081584611?i=1000408984756
• Shop Class as Soulcraft by Matthew B. Crawford: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/301618/shop-class-as-soulcraft-by-matthew-b-crawford/
• Barnyard: The Original Party Animals: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barnyard_(film)
• Heavyweight Episode 02: "Gregor" https://gimletmedia.com/shows/heavyweight/brholm
• "Bartleby, the Scrivener" by Herman Melville: http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/11231
• Playing God by Andy Crouch: https://www.ivpress.com/playing-god

And... looking ahead to next week's episode, we highly recommend checking out Derek DelGaudio's magnificent philosophical magic show, In & Of Itself: https://store.cineplex.com/Product/derek-delgaudios-in-of-itself

Music:

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

Jonathan and Jeff continue looking at some of the ground-level issues that relate to the experience of capitalism: this week they look at "barriers to entry". Barriers to entry is a term that economists use to talk about obstacles that new firms can encounter when they attempt to enter the market. The conversation careens between discussions of patents to economies of scale to the benefits of competition to the Housing First initiative to Medicine Hat and Rudyard Kipling to copyright to beer brewing laws to a great Parks and Rec episode -- not necessarily in that order -- and eventually they even explore the questions of what constitutes "bad" barriers to entry and what might "good" ones include? 

Want to chime in? Email us at: subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com

Show Notes:

Parks and Recreation, "Bailout" (2013): https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2649404/

Music:

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay

Intermission Music: "Uncut Gems" by Mezhdunami on Pixabay on Pixabay

Jeff and Jonathan discuss Marx's idea of alienation, and try to better understand it by sidestepping theory to talk more about Dairy Queen. They explore questions like: What kind of work is meaningful? What deprives us of pride in our work? Does modern work interfere with the best parts of being human?  Is management theory itself evidence alienation or does it aim to alleviate it? Are metrics part of the problem or a cure? Are we more mind or body, and what role does our "creatureliness" play in shaping meaning in our lives? 

Want to chime in? Email us at: subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com 

Show Notes: 

"The end of life hacking" (Laura Miller): https://slate.com/culture/2019/06/life-hacking-productivity-tech-silicon-valley-hacking-life-book-review.html 

"Goals Gone Wild" (Ordóñez et al.): https://www.hbs.edu/ris/Publication%20Files/09-083.pdf 

"Building a practically useful theory of goal setting and task motivation: A 35-year odyssey" (Locke & Latham): https://www.researchgate.net/publication/11152729_Building_a_practically_useful_theory_of_goal_setting_and_task_motivation_-_A_35-year_odyssey 

Music: 

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay 

Intermission Music: "Future Ambient" by BeachVibes-Music on Pixabay

Jeff and Jonathan continue their long-winded/long-winding discussion on capitalism. They explore a number of questions, including: How do we get from where we are to what's next? Do we have to address all the ills of the past or can we start from where we are at? They touch on Adam Smith, Milton Friedman, the literal definition of capitalism, exploitation and the rules of capitalism, externalities, the Rocky Mountains, the ubiquity of lies, Will Smith, Uber supply and demand, and more. 

Show Notes:  

Milton Friedman, "The Social Responsibility of Business is to Increase Profits": https://www.nytimes.com/1970/09/13/archives/a-friedman-doctrine-the-social-responsibility-of-business-is-to.html

Music: 

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay 

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

We discuss Scott Alexander's 2018 post comparing "mistake theorists" and "conflict theorists" in order to try to understand what contributes to polarization (like those surrounding the question of capitalism). Is this typology useful? Maybe we need to add an axis? What about Shane Claiborne? The conversation proceeds to cover William Blake, Walter Wink, some more Adam Smith, Noam Chomsky, and more. The episode culminates with a sweet 2x2 matrix that takes Scott Alexander's binary and propels it into a 3rd dimension!!

 

Show Notes: 

"Mistake vs Conflict" blog post on Slate Star Codex: https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/01/24/conflict-vs-mistake/

Nathan Robinson podcast on Vox: https://www.vox.com/podcasts/2020/1/7/21055676/nathan-robinson-ezra-klein-socialism-bernie-sanders

Syndicate.Network symposium about Eugene McCarraher's "The Enchantments of Mammon": https://syndicate.network/symposia/theology/the-enchantments-of-mammon/

"Hayek vs Keynes" Rap Battle: https://youtu.be/d0nERTFo-Sk 

Music: 

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay 

Intermission Music: "Uncut Gems" by Mezhdunami on Pixabay and "Journey" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

Continuing our conversation on capitalism, Jonathan kicks off this episode with a discussion of one of the fathers of capitalism, Adam Smith. Both Jon and Jeff reveal their Hegelian leanings. From there, we talk about some of the differences between Smith and Marx. Needle factories also come up much more often than one might typically expect in a podcast (at least these days). We discuss history and the value of widening our "temporal bandwidth" (to borrow Alan Jacobs's / Thomas Pynchon's term). We then start charting some possible directions our discussion can go from here, including an interesting blog post (see link below) all about different ways of approaching complex systems and how this might connect to contemporary politics. 

(A quick note: In this episode, we refer to Scott Alexander's idea of "mistake theorist" as "problem theorist.")

Want to chime in? (It sure beats yelling at a wall). Email us at: subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com

Show Notes: 

The Toaster Project: http://www.thetoasterproject.org/

"Conflict vs. Mistake" by Scott Alexander: https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/01/24/conflict-vs-mistake/

Music:

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

In this episode, Jonathan and Jeff continue their rambling and insufficiently informed discussion of capitalism by talking about language — and also two Jacqueses (Derrida and Lacan), Benoit Mandelbrot, the bullsh*t asymmetry principle, quantum mechanics, Zeno’s paradox, and that’s just in the first fifteen minutes! 

Want to chime in? Email us at: subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com

Show Notes: 

"Happiness" (https://youtu.be/e9dZQelULDk)

Music:

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay

In this episode, Jeff talks to Jonathan about what he's gleaned so far from reading the first half of historian Eugene McCarraher’s book, "The Enchantments of Mammon: How Capitalism Became the Religion of Modernity." The book critiques capitalism from a "left romanticism" perspective and provides a way to discuss what matters for living well; the nature, limitations, opportunities, and failures of our modern situation; and how political and economic structures shape the human experience. 

In addition to McCarraher's tome, this episode roves around all sorts of topics, including Max Weber, sacramental ontology, Milton Friedman, management theory, John Ruskin, Adam Smith, worship, Richard Dawkins, the Outside, and more.  This discussion kicks off a series on the many facets of capitalism -- and we'll be continuing in future episodes to even-more-incompletely touch on many other topics including language, the nature of mental models, the limitations of knowledge, and what meaning there is to be found in the world. 

Want to chime in? Email us at: subjectsinprocesspodcast@gmail.com 

Show Notes: 

Eugene McCarraher's article about John Ruskin in Plough Quarterly: https://www.plough.com/en/topics/justice/comrade-ruskin

Keynes vs. Hayek rap battle: "Fear the Boom and Bust: Keynes vs. Hayek – The Original Economics Rap Battle": https://youtu.be/d0nERTFo-Sk

Music: 

Theme Music: "What u Thinkin? (Instrumental)" by Wataboi on Pixabay 

Intermission Music: "Lazy Morning" by Tim Moor on Pixabay