IBM TechExchange 2025 featured AI, Agents, Observability and other technologies that are changing the way that developers work. In this Enterprise Automation Excellence podcast, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke discuss Dan's learnings from the event and what these trends mean for developers, as well as the implications for automation, development and DevOps teams. A key theme is howthese new tools require rethinking development processes, with a particular focus on the need for guardrails and check points for systems that are relying on non-deterministic AI as part of the solution.
Key Points
Takeaways for Automation Leaders
Takeaways for I&O and DevOps Leaders
Footer
IBM TechXchange 2025 (https://www.ibm.com/community/ibm-techxchange-conference/)
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
Enterprise automation is entering a new era defined by convergence. AI, observability, and orchestration are reshaping how automation platforms operate and how IT organizations deliver reliability and agility. While vendors move rapidly toward orchestration control planes, enterprise adoption remains measured and pragmatic—focused on governance, integration, and operational stability. Drawing on insights from EMA’s ongoing 2025 Workload Automation and Orchestration Radar research, this episode explores how automation teams can evolve to lead in this new landscape.
Key Points
Agentic AI expands—not replaces—centralized orchestration.
The “silo first, then centralize” pattern continues to define automation maturity.
Takeaways for Automation Leaders
Assess how your current automation platform aligns with AI, observability, and orchestration trends.
Position your organization as the “Orchestrator of Orchestrators.”
Pilot intelligent-automation features to build skill and institutional confidence.
Leverage observability data to guide governance and drive automation-led optimization.
Footer
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
While much of the focus on the value of automation systems is on the consistent and reliable execution of the schedule, the data within the automation system can also be valuable to the organization. In this Enterprise Automation Excellencepodcast, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke explore how automation systems serve as critical sources of truth for business operations. They explain that automation teams manage key data repositories that become the singleauthoritative record for business processes. The discussion covers the challenges of maintaining data quality, the security risks involved, and the growing importance of this data for AI and analytics initiatives. The hosts emphasize that automation leaders need to recognize their role as data stewards and actively engage with other business leaders to share the valuable information they maintain.
Key Points
The historical and operational data in automation systems can provide valuableinput for corporate AI and analytics initiatives
Takeaways for Automation Leaders
Footer
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke discuss the evolution from traditional agents to AI-powered agents in enterprise automation software. While automation agents originally served as proxies for remote system operations, AI agents now bring capabilities that enables generative and adaptive responses. Their discussion positions AI agents as an evolution rather than revolution in automation, offering enhanced decision-making capabilities while following similar architectural patterns as traditional agents. Automation leaders should prepare for integration with enterprise systems that have adopted AI agent capabilities, requiring the same coordination, governance and control ofsystems that may have unanticipated behaviors.
Key Points
Takeaways for Automation Leaders
Request for Listeners
If you're starting to integrate AI agents into your automation environment, we would really love to hear from you. We want to hear from some automation team who are using AI agents, so if you're doing interesting things, please reach out to us.
Footer
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
In this episode, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke explore the challenges of migrating automation software. They discuss the business and technical drivers for switching to a different automation tool, what makes these projects difficult, and why migration is occurring more frequently. Key Points
Five Learnings
Takeaways for Automation Leaders Considering Migration
Footer EAE Podcast Home: [https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence](https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence) Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
Roy Dreyfus, Senior Director of IT at Market America, discusses his 14-year automation journey with Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke on the Enterprise Automation Excellence Podcast. Roy shares how Market America has evolved from basic, disconnected automation tools to a sophisticated orchestration platform using HCL Workload Automation (HWA). Market America is now transitioning to HCL's new AI-powered Uno platform, which combines automation with artificial intelligence capabilities.
Key Points
Takeaways for Automation Leaders
Show Links
Roy Dreyfuss discussing HCL automation on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1F6Z_3-xfGo
Roy's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/leroy-dreyfuss-cio/
Dan's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dantwing/
Tom's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tomorourkeEAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
A successful automation strategy requires moving beyond technology-focused thinking to business outcome-driven approaches, with AI serving as an enabler rather than an end goal.
In this Enterprise Automation Excellence episode, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke present a strategic framework that moves beyond technology-focused approaches to business outcome-driven automation planning.
Key Points
Takeaways for Automation Leaders
Footer
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
In this Enterprise Automation Excellence episode, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke discuss AI's impact on enterprise automation and orchestration. Dan takes a more optimistic stance while Tom adopts a pragmatic perspective on AI adoption timelines. They recognize that AI technologies like neural networks and machine learning are already deployed in enterprise environments, and that the current focus is on new capabilities like Large Language Models (LLMs) and agentic AI.
The hosts agree that current AI implementations in automation tools are being driven by vendor marketing rather than customer demand, with many products adding AI features as competitive necessities rather than selecting customer-requested solutions. They emphasize that meaningful AI adoption in enterprise automation will require years, not months, and success depends heavily on organizational maturity, data quality, and process standardization.
Key Points
Takeaways for Automation Leaders
1. Audit and Improve Data Quality and Process Maturity
Conduct a comprehensive review of your current automation processes and data managementpractices. Focus on standardizing how problems are documented, solutions arerecorded, and processes are executed.
2. Develop a Strategic Partnership Approach with Vendors
Select 1-2 key vendors to work with as strategic partners for adopting AI into the automation portfolio. Establish pilot programs with clear success metrics.
3. Adopt Governance and Validation Frameworks
Learn more about your organization's AI governance and validation models. Review your existing processes and adjust them to address potential risks introduced by the introduction of AI capabilities.
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
In this episode of the Enterprise Automation Excellence podcast, Dan Twing and Tom O’Rourke dive into the 2025 EMA Radar for Workload Automation and Orchestration—the most significant overhaul in the Radar’s 16-year history.
They explore how three foundational technology shifts—orchestration, observability, and AI/agentic capabilities—are reshaping the automation landscape. Vendors are advancing unevenly across these areas, creating a patchwork of strengths that reflect both customer priorities and technical readiness. From data pipelines and container orchestration to AI-driven workflows and the evolving role of legacy capabilities, this conversation maps where the market is going—and what leaders should be watching.
Key Topics:
Why orchestration, observability, and AI now define best-in-class WLA
What’s changed in the 2025 Radar measurement criteria—and why it matters
Challenges in adopting multiple complex technologies simultaneously
How cloud platforms are changing automation architecture priorities
The market’s journey from fragmented experimentation to standardization
Takeaways for Automation Leaders:
Integration of the "automation triad" is a competitive advantage—but also a challenge
Customer-vendor collaboration is key to success in emerging capability areas
Legacy functionality still matters: don’t lose focus on what’s already working
Product roadmaps are increasingly shaped by Radar cycles and timing pressures
Listen now to understand where enterprise automation is heading—and how to get ahead of the curve.
EAE Podcast Home: EM360Tech – EAE Series
Feedback & Questions: eaepodcast@emausa.com
In the second half of their focus on product thinking hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke discuss how automation teams can apply product thinking principles to shift from operating reactively as service providers into a strategic-minded,customer value-focused organization.
Key themes include managing automation asa product portfolio, developing strategic roadmaps, implementing iterative planning processes, and building compelling business cases for automation investments. The episode emphasizes the importance of understanding customer needs through frameworks like "Jobs to Be Done" and Value Proposition Canvas, while providing practical guidance on piloting product thinking initiatives and securing funding for automation improvements.
Learnings
Action Items for Piloting Product Thinking
Key Success Factor: Start small and focus on learning rather than perfection. The goal is to test whether product thinking approaches resonate in your organization and build momentum for broader adoption.
Questions & Comments
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto: eaepodcast@emausa.com
In this Enterprise Automation Excellence episode, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke explore how automation teams can adopt "product thinking" to better serve business needs and stakeholders. Rather than focusing solely on technology delivery, product thinking shifts the emphasis to understanding customer problems and working backward to solutions. This approach helps automation leaders move from reactive, ad-hoc service delivery to strategic, value-driven automation portfolios that align with business outcomes and demonstrate the importance of automation to business activities.
Key Takeaways
Start with the job to be done, not the requested tool or technology.
A request for "Airflow" might really mean "avoid failed reports on Monday morning."
Use the Value Proposition Canvas to align automation services to real customer pains and gains.
Different internal customers (such as HR, ERP, and DevOps teams) need tailored automation approaches.
Mapping your automation portfolio to customer needs exposes both gaps and unused offerings.
Recommendations for IT Leaders
Start with the real problem—don’t just deliver what was requested.
Ask “What are you hiring this automation to do?” before committing resources.
Map automation offerings to each customer segment you serve.
Balance demand with budget and staffing realities.
Justify automation investments by showing business impact—not technical features.
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellenceFeedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
In this Enterprise Automation Excellence episode, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke discuss "automation myopia" - the problem of defining automation needs too narrowly, leading to suboptimal tool selection. They explore how development teams often focus on solving a narrow set of automation requirements, rather than considering end-to-end processes. The hosts advocate for broader thinking that considers operational requirements, business needs, and regulatory concerns beyond just a project’s technical requirements. They recommend wrapping specialized tools within enterprise-wide orchestration systems to maintain visibility of the complete business process while still leveraging the capabilities of specialized automation tools.
Key Points
Development teams often define automation problems too narrowly, leading to isolated point solutions that can't satisfy broader business requirements
EAE Podcast Home: https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence
Feedback & Questions: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
In this episode, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke discuss the relationship between observability and automation in enterprise systems. They explore how observability tools and standards like OpenTelemetrycan improve automation orchestration by providing visibility into the entire business process ecosystem. The hosts note that while observability technology is still in early stages for automation, it represents a significant opportunity to enhance orchestration capabilities, reduce downtime, and provide actionable business insights beyond technical metrics. They emphasize the need for standards development and collaboration between automation and observability teams.
Key Findings
Key Takeaways
Action Items
References
In this episode, hosts Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke discuss the complex relationship between change management and automation. They explore how these two control functions must work together despite their inherent tensions--automation requires stability to function reliably, while modern business environments demand frequent changes. The conversation examines how automation teams navigate changes from multiple sources: application updates, infrastructure changes, automation tool updates, citizen developers, and external vendors. The hosts emphasize the need for balanced governance that enables business agility while maintaining system integrity, noting that emerging technologies like AI will further complicate this balance while potentially offering future solutions.
Key Findings
Recommendations
Questions and Comments
[EAE Podcast Home](https://em360tech.com/podcast-series/enterprise-automation-excellence)
Contact Us: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke discuss EMA's latest research report titled "The Future of Workload Automation and Orchestration: Driving Digital Transformation with Orchestration and Generative AI". The hosts explore the evolving landscape of workload automation, highlighting how it has become a central hub for orchestration across enterprises. The conversation covers key trends including growth in the number of jobs, staffing and skill challenges, the rise of observability, and the impact of AI on automation strategies. The research shows workload automation tools are evolving into enterprise-wide orchestration platforms that connect business processes beyond just technical automations.Key Findings
Recommendations
Show Links:Enterprise Management AssociatesEMA Future of Workload Automation and Orchestration ReportEMA webinarContact Us: mailto:eaepodcast@emausa.com
This episode discusses the role and evolution of Automation Centers of Excellence (CoE) in enterprises. The hosts, Dan Twing and Tom O'Rourke, explore how CoEs have become critical organizational structures for managing automation initiatives, discussing how CoEs serve as knowledge-sharing hubs, bridge gaps between technical teams and citizen developers, and help standardize automation practices.
Key Points
-CoEs are an organizational pattern found in large enterprises to coordinate important cross-group initiatives by streamlining the sharing of technical and organizational knowledge
-The majority of automation organizations have either formal or informal CoEs
-CoEs' roles vary from controlling all automation changes to consultative support of citizen developers
-Automation CoEs are expanding, with 84% reporting moderate to significant growth
-Automation CoEs can become a bottleneck if they are under-resourced or their work is deprioritized
-CoEs can provide essential governance and risk management function, assisting citizen developers in complying with business policies and technology standards
-Looking beyond automation, CoEs will be crucial for integrating new technologies like AI with existing systems
Dan and Tom discuss Tom's observations and learnings from the 2024 Gartner IT Infrastructure, Operations & Cloud Strategies conference in Las Vegas. 
AI and improving Infrastructure & Operations (I&O) leadership were key themes, with sessions addressing strategic and tactical approaches for technology, business, and staffing issues.
The I&O outlook for 2025 and beyond was optimistic, while acknowledging executive frustrations with the increasing costs of cloud, failures of major projects, and the disruptions generated from CVEs and other security events. 
Key Ideas
- **Generative AI**: Gartner believes that we are still in the early days with respect to AI, with many immediate opportunities for productivity improvements that need to be balanced with potential risks and unpredictable costs, highlighting the lack of best practices and challenges moving from a POC to production.
- **Automation & Orchestration**: Automation teams need to focus on value to their customers, prioritizing efforts to orchestrate business processes over tactical task automation. Automation leaders should adopting Agile development processes and metrics for managing their team's efforts.
- **I&O Agile Adoption**: Highlighting enterprises that have introduced Infrastructure Platform Engineering (IPE) and Site Reliability Engineering(SRE), Gartner recommends restructuring the infrastructure organization around these disciplines, looking holistically at the infrastructure as a managed platform, and adopting product management thinking as a framework for managing the evolution of the environment.
- **Digital Employee Experience (DEX)**: Building on feedback from corporate boards, Gartner highlighted staffing and skill shortages as a workforce risk and impediment to business transformation initiatives, which is leading to an evolution in employee tools and rethinking about management approaches to improve employee engagement job satisfaction. 
- **I&O Leadership**: I&O leaders need to become more
strategically-focused and proactive in managing their portfolios, aligning their priorities with key business initiatives and building up the confidence and trust of the executive team in I&O. 
Takeaways
- Prepare for integrating the new AI-driven tools and data flows integrating into the infrastructure
- Find ways to use AI tools that help with day-to-day activities, but make sure that there are checks of the AI-generated results
- Shifting to Infrastructure as Code approaches to make updates to the environment can reduce risks and improve security
- Collect and review metrics for the customer experience, not just technology operations
- Agile retrospectives can be a powerful learning mechanism for improving staff skills and performance
- Allocate time to skill development for yourself and your team, consider where upskilling is more effective and quicker than hiring
- Be prepared to discuss the value of I&O projects in the context of business initiatives, not just the technical results that they provide
Show Links
[Gartner IT Infrastructure, Operations & Cloud Strategies Conference](https://www.gartner.com/en/conferences/na/infrastructure-operations-cloud-us)
[AI and the Future of Work, Paul Redmond](https://paul-redmond.co.uk/speaking/)
[Transformational Leadership, Carla Harris](https://www.carlaspearls.com)
[Super-Communicators, Charles Duhigg](https://www.charlesduhigg.com/supercommunicators)
Dan has returned from Italy where he participated in an HCL Automation customer event focused on orchestration of business processes as an integrated element of a centralized automation solution.
HCL has embraced orchestration as encompassing business process automation as an extension of traditional job scheduling and workload automation, leveraging the centralized automation team and controls that exist in many organizations.
HCL announced the 2nd generation of their Universal Orchestrator product, integrating with the other elements of their Automation Orchestrator Suite.
Key Ideas:
- Automation continues to increase in strategic importance, over 40% of IT executives are now measured on automation expansion (up from 30%)
- Use of automation tools by _citizen developers_ outside of the centralized automation team continues to increase as well, allowing the process experts to shape the automations they rely on and expanding the number of processes that
are automated.
- The empowerment of citizen developers raise challenges with change control and governance, sometimes interfering with the automation team's efforts to maintain reliability and resilience
  - 28% of enterprises have significant citizen developer
contributions
  - 52% limit citizen developers to experimental work
  - 20% use citizen developers primarily for requirements definition
- Automation tools need additional work to support citizen development effectively
Show Links:
- HCL Universal Orchestrator: https://www.hcl-software.com/automation-orchestration/uno
We're most of the way through 2024 and it's time to start thinking about plans for next year. In many cases, the budget has already been set, but it's still important to think through what your priorities will be and how to allocate time for yourself and your team.
Important Trends:
* Digital Transformation – 70% of organizations are in the midst of transformation efforts, relying heavily on automation services to achieve their digitization goals
* Cloud Migration – Increasing push toward multi-cloud and hybrid cloud, strategic focus on SaaS applications
* Expanding Automation User Base – Growing emphasis on citizen developers, business teams taking on more automation responsibilities
* AI Integration – new integrations, increased need for data management
* Data Analytics – more production applications, growing importance in business decision making
* Cybersecurity – continued focus on keeping automation software updated, access management controls
* Legacy systems – slow retirement of legacy hardware and software, requiring maintenance of specialized knowledge of automation integrations
While many automation leaders feel that their teams have no time to take on additional work, the payback on service and skill enhancements can be high.  We advocate being proactive in selecting areas where they can make improvements.
- Organization Alignment – understand your organization's business goals and make sure that your team's efforts are supporting the business plans
- Service Improvement – find an area where you can improve the way you serve a user group, such as reducing the time to fulfill a user request.
- Team Development – determine what skills you and your automation team need to support the business goals and evolving technology portfolio of your organization 
- Communication Plans – develop communication strategies to keep you team, management, stakeholders and users aware of what you're doing to deliver automation services to the organization
To get started, allocate a couple of hours a week of your time to an improvement initiative. Identify a project that will address immediate operational needs or a strategic effort that will help you get to where you need to be in the long term. Share your improvement plan with your team and
manager so that they can support you in the project.
Good luck, and let us know if you have any questions.
Chris Steffen joins the EAE podcast to discuss how automation teams can collaborate with security teams to maintain a secure, resilient environment.
Enterprise automation is expected to orchestrate critical processes 24x7x365. Automation teams must address risks from infrastructure failures and security vulnerabilities in their tools and environments.
Key Ideas
- Automation systems carry high risk due to their critical role and extensive integrations across business, analytics, and operations.
- Cloud and SaaS foundations still require automation teams to understand configurations for reliability.
- Business-critical automation systems often demand 99.999% availability ("five nines").
- Risk assessment is the first step to address cybersecurity, examining implementation, integrations, operations, and access controls.
- Limiting access privileges and eliminating unused accounts reduces vulnerability.
- Changes to systems can impact availability and security, requiring careful change management proportional to risks.
- Security teams and automation teams share the goal of a reliable, resilient environment.
Takeaways for Automation Leaders
- Regularly assess risks from human error, software defects, and third-party failures. Test updates in non-production environments before rollout.
- Build relationships with security teams to prioritize risks and improve team knowledge.
- Audit access management to identify and limit unused or excessive privileges.
- Review change processes for automations, software, and infrastructure to identify mitigations for significant risks.
Show Links
- Chris Steffen - Cybersecurity Awesomeness podcast - Zero Trust Working Group for the Cloud Security Alliance - "Five Nines" High Availability (Wikipedia) - NIST Cybersecurity Framework - SANS Institute