Jonathan Schecter is joined again by senior Buddhist teacher, musician, and author David Nichtern for a wide-ranging, deeply reflective conversation.Together they explore how presence and practice intersect with modern expanded states — from breathwork to psychedelics to the possibilities and limitations of AI as a spiritual teacher.You’ll hear insights on:✅ Why presence can’t be grasped✅ The concept of the “fourth moment” in Buddhist practice✅ How breathwork teaches surrender without substances✅ The risks of spiritual bypassing in psychedelic spaces✅ Whether AI can embody consciousness or wisdom✅ The role of humor, humility, and formal practice✅ How Buddhist wisdom can evolve to fit modern culture✅ David's upcoming Mindfulness Meditation Teacher TrainingThis is an honest and inspiring dialogue on integration, wholeness, and the real work of transformation.00:00 Intro05:00 Walking out of time — presence & fourth moment12:00 Surrender in breathwork vs psychedelics18:00 The God realm & spiritual bypassing25:00 Can AI become a spiritual teacher?34:00 Blind spots, feedback, and the human ego42:00 Buddha nature & somatic healing51:00 What do we most need as a collective?56:00 Basic goodness, genuine sadness, and activism1:02:00 Dharma Moon teacher training & modern culture1:10:00 Final reflections — carrying the teachings forwardDharma Moon Links:🌐 Dharma Moon Meditation Teacher Training: https://www.dharmamoon.com/mindfulness-meditation-teacher-training📚 Awakening from the Daydream & Creativity, Spirituality & Making a Buck — available wherever books are soldConnect with Jonathan & Blue Magic Alchemy:🌐 https://www.bluemagicalchemy.com🌐 https://www.skool.com/bluemagicalchemy💌 Subscribe to the Pathways & Portals newsletter: https://bluemagicalchemy.substack.com/