When End Poverty in California (EPIC) founder, leader of Mayors for a Guaranteed Income, and Homeboy Industries Board Member Michael Tubbs sits down with Tom Vozzo, former CEO of Homeboy Industries, who helmed a $1.6 billion for-profit corporation previously, the conversation turns from policy to practice.
Tubbs made headlines as the youngest U.S. mayor (Stockton, California), cutting gun violence by 40 percent and launching a universal basic income pilot that reframed poverty current policy nationwide.
Yet as he and Tom discuss, Homeboy Industries has been living those principles for decades, offering belonging as basic income and kinship as public safety.
This episode is not about what the government could do better; it’s about what already works. Through Homeboy’s model of employment, healing, and radical inclusion, Tom and Michael show that lasting change starts with relationship, not policy.
This episode bridges two worlds: policy and practice. Listeners will see how Homeboy’s reentry model functions as a living economy of care, and why Tubbs calls it “the moral north star for every city that wants to work.
Key Takeaways
Policy Is a Blueprint, Homeboy Is the Building - Tubbs designed programs to lift people out of poverty; Homeboy creates pathways that make poverty obsolete. Jobs, training, therapy, and community operate as one system of care.
Kinship Outperforms Bureaucracy - Where city systems stagnate under red tape, Homeboy moves at the speed of trust, responding to trauma, grief, and talent in real time.
Economic Justice Is Personal - Homeboy’s “second chance economy” proves that healing is an economic strategy. Every paycheck funds recovery, family stability, and neighborhood peace.
In This Episode:
03:47 - Personal loss, family incarceration, and the call to politics
08:37 - Violence reduction in Stockton through Advanced Peace
09:48 - Government inertia and leadership’s role in disruption
17:17 - Poverty, wages, and the working poor
22:05 - Guaranteed income pilot outcomes in Stockton
31:26 - Nonprofit structure, humanity, and coalition building
33:57 - Homeboy as a model: clients → leaders
36:26 - Hope, resilience, and the next generation
Notable Quotes
[05:22] “Policy starts with a bill; Homeboy starts with a person.” – Tom Vozzo
[09:40] “Government can test ideas, Homeboy shows us what happens when those ideas become community.” – Michael Tubbs
[16:08] “We don’t need a pilot program — we’ve been piloting love for 35 years.” – Fr. Greg Boyle (as quoted by Tom)
About Michael Tubbs
Michael Tubbs is the former mayor of Stockton, California, and a national advocate for economic justice. At 26, he became the youngest mayor of any major U.S. city, using his platform to push for innovative policies aimed at reducing poverty and increasing access to opportunity. Michael is a champion for universal basic income and founded End Poverty in California, a nonprofit dedicated to addressing systemic poverty. He is a board member of Homeboy Industries and continues to work towards building equitable systems in government and beyond.
Resources and Links
Homeboy Industries
Homeboy Media
Michael Tubbs
Thomas Vozzo