Pastors and ministry leaders are carrying more than ever—and too many are doing it in silence. Dr. Mark Mayfield (author of The Mental Health Handbook for Ministry, professor, clinician, and former pastor) joins Alan to demystify mental health in the church, unpack the real difference between coaching and counseling, and give you a practical playbook for when struggles walk into your office… or show up on your staff. This isn’t theory—it’s field-tested, grace-filled, and immediately actionable. In this episode you’ll learn: Coaching vs. Counseling (the clean line): when you need tools to move forward vs. when you need to heal backward How to spot pop-psych “silver bullets” and what trustworthy care actually looks like A fast diagnostic lens for depression: intensity + duration (and what to do next) ADHD or overloaded attention? Trauma, screens, and why so many leaders are being mis-labeled Burnout’s bottom layer: dissociation/avoidance—and how to interrupt the loop Boundary basics for pastors (why “I don’t know—let me check” is leadership strength) How to build a staff culture of care (and discuss hard topics without guessing) Chapter Markers 00:00 — Why this conversation matters now 02:30 — Coaching vs. counseling: the simplest way to decide 05:25 — The danger of pop psychology & “quick fixes” 08:20 — Inside The Mental Health Handbook for Ministry (how to use it fast) 12:25 — High-performing families & hidden pressure 16:30 — Where churches are actually making progress 19:10 — Staff discussions you should be having (and how) 20:40 — Depression in leaders: signs & next steps 32:30 — ADHD or attention trained by trauma & screens? 36:00 — What sits under burnout—and how to respond 40:50 — A word to lonely leaders: you don’t have to know it all Resources Mentioned Book: The Mental Health Handbook for Ministry — Dr. Mark Mayfield (Baker) Site: MentalHealthMadeSimple.life (discussion guides & tools)Mental Health Made Simple: For the churches Stay Forth: Coaching for healthy + high-impact leadership About Dr. Mark Mayfield Clinician, professor at Colorado Christian University, author, speaker, and former pastor. Mark equips churches to receive and care well for people in mental and emotional struggle—and to keep pastors healthy in the process.