He warned NATO about Russia long before the tanks rolled into Ukraine and built one of the world’s most advanced digital societies from a country once dismissed as a “former Soviet republic.”
In this episode of The Diplomat, former Estonian President Toomas Hendrik Ilves joins Joe Kawly to reveal how ignorance, prejudice, and misplaced faith in dialogue left NATO exposed and how Estonia turned technology into a tool of national survival.
From cyberattacks that shut down his country to diplomatic battles over language and perception, Ilves offers a rare inside look at how small states survive in a world shaped by bigger powers’ blind spots.

A must-listen for anyone interested in NATO, Russia, cybersecurity, and the hidden rules of diplomacy in dangerous times.

• Joe Kawly brings extensive experience from conflict zones in the Middle East to the power corridors of Washington. As a journalist, he’s seen how words can escalate a crisis or open the door to peace. A Georgetown graduate and former CNN Journalism Fellow, he’s known for connecting the dots others miss, so people don’t just hear what happened, they understand why it matters. As producer and host of The Diplomat, Joe brings clarity to diplomacy and politics, one conversation at a time.