In this episode of The Agile For Agilists Podcast, hosts Brad Nelson and Drew Podwal sit down with Andrew Clay Shafer, a luminary in software development, entrepreneurship, and the DevOps movement. Together, they explore how Agile principles have existed long before the Agile Manifesto, diving into the history of Sociotechnical Systems and how these timeless practices shape successful organizations—sometimes in surprising ways.

Andrew shares his perspective on why companies thrive regardless of whether they adhere to "textbook" Agile practices and why necessity drives innovation. Along the way, the conversation weaves into the current landscape of AI, emphasizing the critical importance of task decomposition as a future-proof skill. Whether you're an Agile enthusiast, a DevOps advocate, or simply curious about the intersection of technology and human collaboration, this episode is packed with insights you won’t want to miss.