In this episode, host Aaron Crow sits down with OT security expert Justin Searle, Director of ICS Security at InGuardians, for a deep dive into the ever-evolving world of OT and IT cybersecurity.  With over 25 years of experience, ranging from hands-on engineering and water treatment facilities to red-team penetration testing on critical infrastructures such as airports and power plants, Justin brings a wealth of insight and real-world anecdotes. This episode unpacks what it really takes to assess and secure operational technology environments. Whether you’re a C-suite executive, a seasoned cyber pro, or brand new to OT security, you’ll hear why network expertise, cross-team trust, and careful, collaborative engagement with engineers are so crucial when testing high-stakes environments. Aaron and Justin also discuss how the industry has matured, the importance of dedicated OT cybersecurity teams, and why practical, people-first approaches make all the difference, especially when lives, reliability, and national infrastructure are on the line. Get ready for actionable advice, hard-earned lessons from the field, and a candid look at both the progress and the ongoing challenges in protecting our most critical systems.   Key Moments:  05:55 Breaking Into Cybersecurity Without Classes 09:26 Production Environment Security Testing 13:28 Credential Evaluation and Light Probing 14:33 Firewall Misconfiguration Comedy 19:14 Dedicated OT Cybersecurity Professionals 20:50 "Prioritize Reliability Over Latest Features" 24:18 "IT-OT Convergence Challenges" 29:04 Patching Program and OT Security 32:08 Complexity of OT Environments 35:45 Dress-Code Trust in Industry 38:23 Legacy System Security Challenges 42:15 OT Cybersecurity for IT Professionals 43:40 "Building Rapport with Food" 47:59 Future OT Cyber Risks and Readiness 51:30 Skill Building for Tech Professionals   About the Guest :  Justin Searle is the Director of ICS Security at InGuardians, specializing in ICS security architecture design and penetration testing.  He led the Smart Grid Security Architecture group in the creation of NIST Interagency Report 7628 and played critical roles in the Advanced Security Acceleration Project for the Smart Grid (ASAP-SG), National Electric Sector Cybersecurity Organization Resources (NESCOR), and Smart Grid Interoperability Panel (SGIP).     Justin has taught hacking techniques, forensics, networking, and intrusion detection courses for multiple universities, corporations, and security conferences.  His current courses at SANS and Black Hat are among the world's most attended ICS cybersecurity courses.  Justin is currently a Senior Instructor for the SANS Institute and a faculty member at IANS. In addition to electric power industry conferences, he frequently presents at top international security conferences such as Black Hat, DEFCON, OWASP, HITBSecConf, Brucon, Shmoocon, Toorcon, Nullcon, Hardware.io, and AusCERT.