Opinion Party: the marketing podcast
brought to you by BAV Group & IRG 

Season 2: Episode 5

Beyond Brand vs. Performance: Transcending Marketing Dichotomies with Tariq Hassan

SUMMARY

Is the battle between brand and performance a false war? In this episode, Tariq Hassan, a seasoned marketing leader who has served as both CMO and CXO for iconic brands like McDonald's and Petco joins host Laura Jones, Global CEO of BAV Group. Tariq argues that pitting long-term brand building against short-term performance is an irrelevant and outdated debate. True success lies in making them coexist. Drawing from his personal "Ikigai" (or purpose) and a powerful story about his daughter's resilience, Tariq makes the case for vulnerable, human-centered leadership. He shares the secrets behind McDonald's most viral campaigns—like the Adult Happy Meal and the Grimace Birthday—revealing how they were born from "fan truths" and designed to create cultural experiences that drive performance. The conversation culminates in a powerful discussion about "humanized growth" and the concept of a "People P&L," a revolutionary way to measure the health of a business by the growth and confidence of its employees.

LINKS

• Laura Jones: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lapjones/   
• Tariq Hassan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tariqhassan1/
• BAV Group: https://www.bavgroup.com
• Institute for Real Growth: https://instituteforrealgrowth.com
• Red Helicopter: https://www.redhelicopter.com/thebook
• Ikigai: https://instituteforrealgrowth.com/pdf/TheFounderPerspectiveTheIkigaiofMarketing.pdf 

TAKEAWAYS

• Stop "Convincing" and Start Aligning: If you find yourself in a position of "convincing" other C-suite members of marketing's value, you're already too late. True alignment happens upstream by ensuring marketing's plan is built around the universally understood goals of the business, with shared accountability from the CFO and operations from day one.
• Embrace "Boring is Beautiful": Resist the urge to constantly create for creation's sake. When a core strategy is working, the goal isn't to change it, but to "rinse and repeat" while finding new and exciting ways to execute. A "boring" strategy frees up the team to focus on brilliant execution that creates a strong market signal.
• Capitalize on "Fan Truths" for Performance: The most potent campaigns (like the Adult Happy Meal) come from unearthing simple, powerful truths your fans already believe. These "fan truths" are the key to creating cultural moments that feel authentic and drive massive performance, turning a simple transaction into a memorable brand experience.
• Measure Your "People P&L": The most forward-thinking leaders look beyond the traditional balance sheet. A "People P&L" tracks metrics like employee confidence, trust, and even maternity leave rates as leading indicators of a company's health, stability, and future growth potential.
• Treat Data as a Cultural Language: Data isn't just for targeting; it's a form of currency and language. Using data to demonstrate an intimate understanding of the customer builds a relationship. Using it poorly (e.g., sending an offer for something just purchased) breaks trust and is where personalization becomes "creepy."
• Don't Separate CMO and CXO Thinking: The roles of CMO and CXO are converging. Marketers are accountable for the customer experience everywhere, from external channels to internal operations. Success metrics for CX may start with employee workflow simplification, not just customer transactions, which ultimately leads to better brand interactions.

CHAPTERS

00:00 Navigating Marketing Priorities

02:51 Finding True North: Personal Philosophy in Leadership

05:45 The Role of Vulnerability in Leadership

08:43 Creating Stakeholder Value

11:43 Cross-Functional Collaboration for Success

14:56 Data-Driven Decision Making

17:46 Balancing Brand and Performance Marketing

20:48 The Intersection of CMO and CXO Roles

23:58 Personalization vs. Creepiness in Marketing

26:52 Humanized Growth: A New Paradigm

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Opinion Party: the marketing podcast

For season two, we asked twelve marketing leaders from a world class set of organizations to join host Laura Jones, Global CEO of BAV Group, to talk marketing myths, trends, data, and opinions. Filmed live on site at the Institute for Real Growth Summit in Cannes, summer 2025. Find us at https://www.theopinionparty.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

Season 2 of Opinion Party: the marketing podcast is brought to you by:

BAV Group, the world’s leading authority on data-driven branding.™️
Our strategic consulting services transform brand growth into brand = growth. Whether you need to analyze, transform, or grow your brand, our team provide solutions based on 30 years of proven methodology and results.
Learn more at https://www.bavgroup.com

Institute for Real Growth
We inspire CMOs to increase their personal, business, and societal impact by driving more Humanized Growth.

Learn more at: https://instituteforrealgrowth.com

CREDITS
Host & Executive Producer: Laura Jones
Executive Producer: Ketzirah Lesser
Production & Still Photography: Bronac McNeill Photography & Film
Co-director, Camera, Sound, Edit: Natalie Barrass
Photos © Bronac McNeil Photography & Film