An exploration of one of marketing AI’s hottest trends with Katherin Watier Ong In this episode of No Brainer, Geoff and Greg dive deep into the evolving landscape of search engine optimization with Katherine Watier Ong, founder of WO Strategies. Katherine brings her 10+ years of experience helping science-based organizations navigate the complexities of modern search—from traditional SEO to the emerging world of AI-powered answers. The conversation explores the hype surrounding Answer Engine Optimization (AEO) and Generative Engine Optimization (GEO), with Katherine providing a refreshingly grounded perspective that it's still fundamentally SEO at its core. She shares practical insights on how to optimize for Google's AI Overviews and discusses why the fundamentals haven't changed as much as the industry buzz might suggest. Katherine reveals compelling data showing that while AI-powered search features are getting attention, they currently represent only about 1-3% of actual traffic for most organizations. She emphasizes that brands should focus on solid SEO foundations before chasing the latest AI optimization trends. The discussion also covers the broader challenges facing marketers today, including the rise of zero-click searches, degraded marketing data from GA4, and the increasing difficulty of measurement in a privacy-first world. Chapters ·      06:00 AEO vs GEO: Marketing Hype or Real Distinction? ·      11:34 What Still Matters: SEO Fundamentals That Haven't Changed ·      15:15 The Real Changes: Zero-Click Searches and Data Challenges ·      21:20 AI Integration in SEO Workflows ·      28:50 The Misinformation Problem with AI Answers ·      34:15 User Embeddings and Personalization Bubble Effects ·      39:30 Beyond Brand Control: Why Reddit Matters More Than Press Releases ·      44:10 Measuring Success in the Age of AI Search About Katherine Watier Ong Katherine Watier Ong is the founder and CEO of WO Strategies, a boutique organic traffic consultancy specializing in science-based, enterprise-sized organizations. With over 30 years of marketing experience and 18+ years focused on SEO, she helps federal agencies, nonprofits, and Fortune 500 companies improve their organic search performance. Previously, Katherine served as VP of Online Strategy at Ketchum, where she recruited, trained, and led the online strategy team, providing digital marketing services for global clients including NY State of Health, HHS, Express Scripts, Cleveland Clinic, and Hershey. Her campaigns have had significant impact—she's helped increase traffic from 300K to 1.2 million visits and assisted New Yorkers with health exchange registration. Katherine is an accomplished trainer and public speaker who has provided SEO and digital marketing education for over 13 years. She's spoken at conferences including Voice Global, BrightonSEO, SES, and OMS. Her approach is grounded in her belief that "anyone can create change with enough passion and determination," a philosophy shaped by her early environmental activism work that included building websites, securing NPR coverage, and creating educational curricula. Connect with Katherine: ·      Website: wostrategies.com ·      Free AI Mode Guide: bit.ly/writingforAImode ·      LinkedIn: Katherine W. Ong: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katherinewatier/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices