A NOTE FROM JASON: Hi again. Welcome back. If you've come here for an interview between an actual couple and an actual couples therapist and you're asking yourself the question, “How does a couples therapist learn to do that?” Well, you're in the right place.  I’m Jason Brand, a Licensed Clinical Social Worker in Berkeley and a PACT Level Three therapist. This is Human Nurture.  A couple of sentences to set the stage: Ron and Chakaheir, they've been married 33 years and they came in because they have drifted apart.  By this third interview, they've made real progress by articulating some of the lonely feelings and as you will hear in this episode, they're starting to find each other again.  We've got two more episodes in the Ron and Chakahier series and then we move on to the next couple but let's not get ahead of things. It was such a pleasure getting to know Ron and Chakaheir and being allowed such an intimate view into their lives.  I'd love to hear your thoughts. Feel free to reach out to me at jason@jasonbrand.com.