Our guest this month is Dr Seán Columb, who for over 10 years has been investigating the illegal organ trade. Dr Columb is a legal academic - a senior lecturer in law at the School of Law and Social Justice at the University of Liverpool. Since 2014, he has spoken to over 40 people from countries including Sudan, South Sudan and Eritrea, who were fleeing conflict or the legacy of conflict, and who sold a kidney out of economic necessity. Selling or buying an organ is illegal anywhere in the world, except for Iran. It’s estimated that 10% of organs for transplantation come from illegal sources. The true number is likely higher, according to Seán, who says most cases go unreported because of the precarious legal status of the donors. Most of Seán’s research took place in Egypt, where he says people were targeted by criminal groups because of their vulnerable status as asylum seekers, refugees or undocumented migrants. Seán explains that most were not paid what they had been promised. He believes that these people have been doubly victimised, as illegal migrants and organ sellers. The black market for organs includes kidneys, corneas and liver lobes. Seán’s research relates to the buying and selling of kidneys. He believes there is a rising demand for kidneys partly because of the spread of so-called diseases of affluence – diabetes, hypertension, obesity – and the subsequent rise in kidney failure. He also attributes the increase to the privatisation of healthcare. From his research, Seán wanted to learn about how the trade in organs is organised, and how brokers rationalise what they are doing. Seán says some of the brokers are, indeed, former donors themselves. While doctors who carry out the transplants turn a blind eye to what is happening, according to Seán. From a legal perspective, Seán is interested in how law under certain circumstances can actually generate violence. He says, in many circumstances, this is an unintended consequence of laws and policies that are not really thought out, or understood from a human perspective. He says the focus of criminal investigations should be on the brokers, the personnel in the hospital chains performing the surgeries, including the doctors. Seán says to get good intel on the trade, it should be decriminalised, but by this he does not mean a regulated industry, rather Seán believes that it should be made clear that donors and recipients should not be prosecuted. Presented and produced by Evelyn McClafferty. With thanks to our donors: Irish Aid. Note: The views and opinions expressed in this episode do not necessarily represent those of IRLI or Irish Aid.