With AI search taking over and everyone panicking about the future of SEO, I sat down with Dean Gravina, former Head of SEO at King Kong and Megaphone, to get the real story. What he told me might surprise you.

In this episode, Dean reveals:

✔️ Why he thinks "SEO is dead" panic is just noise (and what's actually changing)

✔️ The 3 SEO fundamentals that work in both Google AND ChatGPT

✔️ When he tells clients to abandon SEO completely (real case study)

✔️ His "CEO email outreach" strategy that's beating traditional link building

✔️ Why local SEO is becoming impossible for small businesses

✔️ The truth about WordPress vs custom sites (controversial take)

✔️ Why most "AI SEO" and "LLM optimisation" terms are marketing BS

Perfect for business owners spending money on SEO and wondering if they're wasting their budget in the AI era.

Dean shares brutal honesty about when SEO works, when it doesn't, and why he sometimes recommends Google Ads over SEO, even as an SEO expert. Plus, real examples from his client work with major Australian brands.

• [00:00] - Dean's journey: From scammed 18-year-old to King Kong SEO head
• [05:00] - What SEO actually means in 2025 (3 core pillars)
• [07:00] - AI search overview: Is it really killing traditional SEO?
• [12:00] - Why big brands dominate AI search results
• [14:00] - How to get mentioned in ChatGPT and AI overviews
• [19:00] - The backlink strategies that actually work today
• [22:00] - Dean's "CEO email outreach" method (genius strategy)
• [25:00] - How AI overview is changing on-page optimisation
• [30:00] - Technical SEO explained: When it matters vs when it doesn't
• [35:00] - Red flags in SEO agency relationships
• [40:00] - AI content: What's working and what Google thinks
• [45:00] - WordPress vs custom sites: Dean's controversial take
• [52:00] - Why local SEO is dying for small businesses
• [57:00] - Real case study: When Dean told a client to stop SEO
• [1:02:00] - Is this the biggest change in SEO history?
• [1:03:00] - Why "LLM optimisation" is mostly marketing noise

Ready to grow your franchise like we did?

Here's how I can help:

📧 Get my FREE Franchise Growth Playbook - The exact strategies I used to grow Jim's Group by 2,000 franchisees: franchisemarketer.beehiiv.com/c/franchise-growth-playbook

📞 Book a 1-on-1 Strategy Call - Let's discuss your specific franchise marketing challenges. Limited spots available: calendly.com/jimsgroupinterview/joelconsultation

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