In this conversation, we dive deep with Jenny Sauer-Klein - a master of designing experiences that don’t just tick a box, but truly move people. Jenny has worked with companies like Airbnb, Google, and Genentech to bring their cultures to life, and she's the founder of The Culture Conference, where leaders come together to build workplaces that actually feel human.We talk about the real difference between experience design and facilitation, and what it takes to balance structure and spontaneity when you're holding a group. Jenny shares her powerful "Primary Shift" framework, the importance of psychological safety, and how connection isn’t just nice to have - it's the foundation for real transformation. If you lead groups, design learning spaces, or just care about helping people grow - this episode is full of hard-won lessons and practical tools that can help you create something deeper. Resources Mentioned: The Primary Shift Culture Conference Facilitation Finesse Course (use code Changemaker20 for 20% off)