Welcome to Elevator Systems! This episode looks at Bowen family systems theory and marriage. Joining Dixie Vandersluys and Katie White is Phil Klever who has spent over two decades doing research on married couples.

Phil Klever has applied Bowen theory in his clinical practice and his personal life over most of his adult life. He has tested Bowen theory hypotheses in his longitudinal family research study. He is a member of Dr. Daniel Papero's postgraduate research seminar, the Bowen theory Journal Club, and the Bowen Center's Research Committee.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• Observing fusion in marriage and the balance of being both a separate and connected person is central in maintaining maturity in marriage
• The influence of the multi-generational family on marriage 
• Thinking through relationship patterns: conflict, distance, triangles, and over and under-functioning
• Keeping a broad perspective of influences on marriage
• Examples: the classic approach/avoid pattern, a personal example of meeting the in-laws, and “The Story of Us”.

Couples and counsellors alike will gain insights to how Bowen theory can inform one’s understanding of the marriage relationship.

Terms you don’t understand? We have episodes on all 8 concepts of Bowen theory and other ideas in Elevator Systems Seasons 1 & 2.

Recommended Resources:

• The Murray Bowen Archives Project 
• Dr. Ronald Richardson: Family Ties that Bind
• Dr. Jenny Brown: Growing Yourself Up
• Peg Donley interview 
• Donley, M (2016) “Bonding and Babies: The Evolution of Biparental Care and The Primary Triangle”, Family Systems, 12,1.
• Phil Klever Research:

Chapters:

• 1998. “Marital Fusion and Differentiation.” In Titelman (Ed.) Clinical Applications of Bowen Family Systems Theory
• 2003. “Marital Functioning and Multigenerational Fusion and Cutoff.” In Titelman (Ed.), Emotional Cutoff
• 2008. “Triangles in Marriage.” In Titelman (Ed.), Triangles: Bowen Family Systems Theory Perspectives
• 2014. “Applying Differentiation of Self in One’s Family.” In Titelman (Ed.), Differentiation of Self
• 2020. “The Primary Triangle and Variation in Family Functioning.” In Keller and Noone (Ed.), Handbook of Bowen Family Systems Theory and Research Methods
• 2020. “The Multigenerational Transmission of Family Unit Functioning.” In Keller and Noone (Ed.), Handbook of Bowen Family Systems Theory and Research Methods

Articles:

• 2018. “Goal Effectiveness and Family Functioning.” The American Journal of Family Therapy 46: 195-212
• 2021. “Divergent Spouse Functioning.” Family Systems 14: 103-130.
• 2023. “Similarity in Spouse Functioning.” Family Systems 17.2: 139-165
• 2025. “Child Focus and the Family Unit: A Comparison of Families with Lower and Higher Child Symptomology.” Family Systems 19, 2: 105-133.

New podcast episodes released every Tuesday this season—stay tuned as we explore relationships across the lifespan! 

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Living Systems Counselling and Training provides educational material for those interested in learning more about Bowen family systems theory

Living Systems Hybrid Conference: October 17–18, 2025

Conference theme: Aging—Individual Challenge or Family Opportunity?

Learn more here

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DISCLAIMER: This podcast is general information about Bowen family systems theory and is not considered the practice of counselling or therapy.  The information presented are the views of the people who say them. Any information used from this podcast is used at your own risk.