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Church is Messy
Rick Henderson and Svea Merry
122 episodes
14 hours ago
Church is messy podcast recorded at Autumn Ridge Church in Rochester, MN
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Christianity
Religion & Spirituality,
Religion
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All content for Church is Messy is the property of Rick Henderson and Svea Merry and is served directly from their servers with no modification, redirects, or rehosting. The podcast is not affiliated with or endorsed by Podjoint in any way.
Church is messy podcast recorded at Autumn Ridge Church in Rochester, MN
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Christianity
Religion & Spirituality,
Religion
Episodes (20/122)
Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Acts of Leadership week 6

Rick and Svea spend much of the episode discussing Paul's warning to the church leaders in Ephesus as found in Acts 20:17-38: watch out for the wolves among you.


A warning from Rick about this episode: It may contain meandering conversation with points of lucidity in a forest of discontinuity and convoluted word salads, but it has been fun.


Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 03:21 Serving is leading and leadership.
  • 06:35 The genius of Scripture: the same passage allowed Rick to pivot the emphasis in response to immediate needs without bending it to fit the new topic. This message's focus: Be on guard - have the back of those whom you lead.
  • 10:57 Wolves prowling around as a threat to the flock: Paul's admonition then and still true today.
  • 12:02 Three ways to spot a wolf: 1) they try to raise your level of fear; 2) they try to lower your level of empathy; and 3) they try to distract you from being an ambassador for Jesus and his kingdom.
  • 12:21 Looking at each wolf tactic: Watch out for those using fear as a manipulator.
  • 17:07 Watch out for those downplaying empathy or even calling it a sin. 
  • 25:33 Watch out for those trying to distract us from the primacy of Jesus.
  • 29:14 How do you overcome the wolves? In every arena of your life, live as though Jesus were living your life: be with Jesus, become more like Jesus, and do as Jesus did. Who we are becoming is more important than what we do.
  • 31:52 The big difference between a true representative of Jesus and a wolf: A true representative will say follow me as I follow Jesus. A wolf will try to get you to join their endeavor and impose aspects of Christianity on others so they can get more control.
  • 34:31 The way of Jesus is always going to be different than any expression of the world's way.
  • 35:17 Playing the movie forward.
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6 days ago
42 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Acts of Leadership - Move Toward the Messes part 2

This week the Acts of Leadership series takes us to Acts 15. Rick and Svea look at circumcision and the old covenant, the new covenant, and James' declaration in Acts 15:19, “It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God."

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 02:41 We will always have to wrestle with issues that would seek to divide us.
  • 05:00 Circumcision: the sign of the old covenant.
  • 11:41 Baptism: the sign of the new covenant. Comparing circumcision with baptism.
  • 13:52 The new covenant is superior to the old covenant. The old covenant started outwardly and hoped it would become inward. The new covenant starts inwardly and expresses itself outwardly.
  • 20:25 If salvation is by faith alone, why did James add four "conditions" on the church in Acts 15?
  • 24:07 James isn't adding conditions to faith in Jesus, he's showing other practices that, if practiced, will pull their hearts away from Jesus and toward other gods.
  • 36:51 The thinking process of looking at Scripture in regard to temporary, cultural application vs permanent.
  • 39:21 If Paul, Peter, and James were addressing the American Church what practices might they suggest that would be helpful in following Jesus?
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1 week ago
43 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Acts of Leadership - Move Toward the Messes part 1

This week Rick and Svea look at Acts 10 and the story of Cornelius.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 06:11 Three questions about leadership: whom am I looking to for leadership, how am I leading myself, who looks to me for leadership.
  • 07:31 Cornelius in Acts 10. He was a complex character, we're all complex characters.
  • 10:12 We're never correct to reduce any person to one defining thing; it tends to bring out one of four bad responses. We're all multifaceted.
  • 13:08 In this passage we get to see how God saw Cornelius.
  • 15:52 A thought experiment.
  • 20:12 Good isn't bad; good is good. It's just not good enough to close the gap between us and God.
  • 23:16 The gap Cornelius had and his angelic visitors. God's methods are intentionally messy and inefficient.
  • 28:14 In this chapter we've seen Cornelius as a leader of people, show self-leadership, and now he looks to Peter for leadership.
  • 34:11 We need to trust Jesus enough to deconstruct our self-imposed rules so that he can rule. It's all about heart orientation.
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2 weeks ago
41 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Acts of Leadership week 3

Pastor Caleb Smith joins Rick and Svea to dig into the story of Philip and the Ethiopian Eunuch.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro and Rick's Boundary Waters adventures.
  • 03:50 Week three of Acts of Leadership: what jumped out of this week's passage?
  • 07:43 Caleb's process in seeing discipleship in this passage.
  • 14:16 Who you are is a greater contribution than what you do.
  • 17:42 The Quadrants: unconscious incompetence, conscious incompetence, conscious competence, unconscious competence.
  • 24:53 Jesus followers should be the most curious people around.
  • 31:11 Applying to whom do we look for leadership, self leadership, and others looking to us for leadership in this passage.
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3 weeks ago
41 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Acts of Leadership - Deep Community

Today Rick and Svea talk about the challenges to developing authentic deep community and provide some ideas for developing this community.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 00:48 This week's focus is on community and the requirement for leadership decisions to shepherd each other.
  • 02:15 We live in a culture that is driven by individualism and isolation.
  • 05:11 Authentic, biblical Christian community isn't easy; it requires bravery, intentional vulnerability, messiness, awkwardness, and sometimes pain.
  • 09:01 A framework for community: intimates, kin, village, tribe.
  • 11:53 Church gatherings at Autumn Ridge are a gathering of a tribe. Community can be experienced and enjoyed, but it is not developed in the tribe. It's developed in the up-close relationships.
  • 13:06 Challenges to developing deep community.
  • 18:37 The fear of rejection.
  • 21:23 Ideas for developing community.
  • 23:45 How fast can this happen? Is there a microwave setting for developing community?
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1 month ago
26 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Acts of Leadership - Am I a Leader?

In today's episode Rick and Svea open discussion on our new series - a survey of the book of Acts: Acts of Leadership.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 02:22 Exciting news about Autumn Ridge and Practicing the Way.
  • 05:18 Acts of Leadership message series: leadership is a destination of discipleship.
  • 07:15 "I'm not really a natural leader" or, "I don't really want to be in a position of leadership."
  • 08:13 Three questions about leadership.
  • 13:33 The disciples question for Jesus and his unexpected answer. He's in the driver's seat; we're not.
  • 20:43 The importance of community. We need to be in relationship with people who are not exactly like we are.
  • 28:51 What does self-leadership look like when we thought we were following a course of action and expectations but God makes it clear the path is different than we thought?
  • 33:33 Recap: The tension of loving God and doing as you please.
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1 month ago
36 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Loving Our Enemies

In today's episode Rick and Svea have a discussion about loving our enemies and hating our enemies.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro - A Sunday afternoon gone wrong.
  • 04:05 An illustration from Rick's Sunday experience.
  • 06:11 Two visions: Love your enemy or hate your enemy.
  • 08:23 What does it look like to love your enemy?
  • 09:55 Paying a price for loving our enemy is a testing point. Not engaging in hero worship when someone says they forgive their enemy.
  • 14:42 The pressure to define "who is my brother" and "who is my enemy" devolves into who is human and who is subhuman and often taints our behaviors toward "others." It's not good for anybody.
  • 18:24 Looking to history to examine crimes against humanity or a particular group of people always begins with using dehumanizing language.
  • 19:07 Svea describes an incident she had from the previous week.
  • 27:09 Jesus gave us a simple (not always easy) handhold: pray for your enemies.
Show more...
1 month ago
32 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: A Response to the Assassination of Charlie Kirk

We begin a new season of Church Is Messy on a very serious note: A response to the assassination of Charlie Kirk.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro - welcome back after Rick's sabbatical.
  • 01:46 A renewed sense of identity as a part of sabbatical.
  • 08:05 The assassination of Charlie Kirk.
  • 10:09 An email we received.
  • 12:22 We're a church that values questions - from everybody.
  • 14:40 Something Rick would do differently if he could.
  • 15:36 Rick's intent in the weekend services.
  • 16:40 At least three broad categories of people regarding Charlie Kirk among those who attend Autumn Ridge Church.
  • 19:55 Sunday morning is not a time to say what can be said, it's a time to say what must be said. What must be said is we are grieving and we need to turn and look to Jesus.
  • 26:04 "The blood of the martyrs is the seed of the church." -Tertullian
  • 30:16 The view that this is a wakeup call for Christians to rise up.
  • 31:46 A question that hasn't been asked yet.
  • 35:05 We owe it to ourselves to slow down and get really honest with ourselves about our demands, wants, and responses.
  • 35:54 It's tragic that empathy has been downplayed, disparaged, and kicked to the curb. Too many Christians see empathy as a negative.
  • 37:11 This is a time to engage in empathy. Empathy is necessary for understanding.
  • 41:04 Who do I trust? Beware of false prophets.
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1 month ago
48 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Take Your Next Step and Trust the Process

In the final episode on our series on the mission, vision, and values of Autumn Ridge Church, Rick and Svea discuss values seven and eight: 7) take your next step and 8) trust the process.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 02:37 Values 7 and 8: 7) Take your next step, and 8) Trust the process.
  • 07:28 Direction over speed.
  • 08:17 There is a logical progression, but there is no checklist in next steps.
  • 10:36 Some logical and some intangible next steps.
  • 18:30 Trust the process.
  • 20:41 Is the process internal or external?
  • 22:49 What does it look like to trust God when we're not seeing results?
  • 24:32 How can we discern the difference between being patient and passivity when it comes to spiritual formation?
  • 25:47 How are these two values in harmony and in tension with each other?
  • 32:25 Each of the values is a faithful summary statement of some aspect of the gospel.
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2 months ago
35 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Move Toward the Messes and Make Generosity Normal

In this continuing series of looking at the mission, vision, and values of Autumn Ridge Church, Rick and Svea turn their attention to values five and six: 5) move toward the messes and 6) make generosity normal.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 01:48 Our mission, vision, and values (mvv) are guardrails that keep us from straying into unhealthy practices.
  • 03:42 Move toward the messes.
  • 05:23 How did Jesus model moving toward the messes?
  • 08:25 What's a common thread Jesus exhibited to work through the messes he encountered?
  • 09:42 How do we follow Jesus in moving toward the messes in a healthy and edifying way?
  • 11:00 Moving toward the messes doesn't mean we're the person who always fixes the mess.
  • 12:19 Avoiding the ditches.
  • 14:57 This value brings out the necessity of authenticity.
  • 16:37 Make generosity normal. It's not just about money.
  • 21:39 This value reminds us to slow down, see the people around us, and make ourselves approachable.
  • 25:01 These two values force us to examine ourselves and see how we're engaging with others.
  • 28:19 What would you say to those who don't feel equipped to move toward the messes or feel like they don't have enough (of whatever) to be generous?
  • 31:51 These values are an expression of following the way of Jesus.
  • 35:18 What will it look like for our church to live out these values?
Show more...
2 months ago
37 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Honor Guests Enthusiastically and Belong Before You Believe

In this continuing series of looking at the mission, vision, and values of Autumn Ridge Church, Rick and Svea turn their attention to values three and four: 3) Honor guests enthusiastically and 4) belong before you believe.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 03:20 Coming to church can be difficult. Knowing people are coming in feeling anxious, what do we want them to experience?
  • 05:32 Hospitality in the church.
  • 07:09 Honor guests enthusiastically: we care more about your experience than our own.
  • 10:16 What are some practical ways we try to honor guests enthusiastically?
  • 13:54 What does it "cost" us to pursue honoring guests?
  • 17:07 Belong before you believe. Probably our most misunderstood value.
  • 22:23 Is there an expiration date on how long someone can belong before they believe?
  • 24:01 You don't have to change anything about you to be around us.
  • 27:16 The dispositions, attitudes and mindsets that help live out this value well.
  • 29:19 Simple steps to take.
  • 30:41 Answering a different question: The fear of compromising the gospel to be a welcoming church.
Show more...
3 months ago
33 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Take Truth Seriously and Give Grace Relentlessly

In this continuing series of looking at the mission, vision, and values of Autumn Ridge Church, Rick and Svea turn their attention to values one and two: Take truth seriously and give grace relentlessly.

Topics discussed in this episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 02:10 Eight values at Autumn Ridge Church. Why do we have them?
  • 05:14 Values one and two: 1) take truth seriously and 2) give grace relentlessly.
  • 06:45 We happily place ourselves underneath the authority of Scripture - even if it means we're out-of-step with culture.
  • 08:28 Is it possible our understanding of truth could change?
  • 11:39 What does it look like for followers of Jesus to follow the truth?
  • 13:42 What does "Speak the truth in love" mean?
  • 16:00 Truth at the expense of grace and grace at the expense of truth: both are damaging.
  • 19:31 Giving grace relentlessly.
  • 21:02 What is grace?
  • 23:14 How do we want to be experienced?
  • 25:13 How do grace and truth intersect with each other?
  • 31:03 Two actions step to take truth seriously and give grace relentlessly.
Show more...
3 months ago
34 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Our Mission, Vision and Values

Rick and Svea kick-off a five-part series on the Mission, Vision, and Values of Autumn Ridge Church.

Topics discussed in this Episode:

  • 0:00 Intro
  • 02:47 Why does Autumn Ridge have a mission statement? Knowing why we say "Yes" and "No" to various opportunities.
  • 04:02 Most of life's hurts happen when we live in contradiction to our purpose.
  • 07:10 Our vision: communicating the kind of church we desire to be.
  • 09:15 Why is it important we have a vision statement?
  • 12:18 Digging in: Every single word in our MVV has been labored over and is important.
  • 12:23 Our Mission - Disciple vs follower of Jesus...
  • 16:06 Fully devoted...
  • 17:35 Three aspects: authority, identity, activity.
  • 20:00 Our Vision - We want to be a church...
  • 20:42 Of all cultures...
  • 24:15 Where Curious people...
  • 25:32 Where Skeptical people...
  • 26:43 And where Hurting people...
  • 29:30 Love to attend.
  • 30:19 Why is it important for our congregation to know and understand our mission and vision?
Show more...
4 months ago
31 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Holy Lit - the Bible as Holy Literature

Rick and Svea discuss the three major goals of the summer's Holy Lit series.

Topics Discussed in this Episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 02:46 Holy Lit - three goals
  • 03:05 Goal one: Uncomplicate our relationship with the Bible.
  • 09:59 If you have a simplistic understanding of the Bible you're going to have a more complicated relationship with it.
  • 12:01 Goal two: Energize our engagement with the Bible.
  • 15:33 Goal three: Expand our ability to understand the Bible.
  • 16:48 Series thesis: This is a backstory to the story of the Bible.
  • 19:36 Why is this important? Aligning with truth.
  • 24:46 The Bible is overwhelming, I don't even know where to start.
  • 28:11 What's coming up in the Podcast.
Show more...
5 months ago
29 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Loaded Questions - How do I not feel like a failure?

Pastor Caleb Smith joins Rick and Svea to close the Loaded Questions series. They discuss success and failure and how society's framework for success is at odds with the Gospel's framework for success.

Topics Discussed in this Episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 00:57 Reflecting on the Loaded Questions series.
  • 04:42 What was it like preparing to speak on failure?
  • 06:20 Svea to Caleb: Did your definitions of success and failure change or grow as a part preparing for this message?
  • 09:46 Embracing the tension of the gospel's framework of success and the inescapable realities of life.
  • 17:17 The rich, young ruler: a case study in questioning the framework of success.
  • 24:39 What does it look like if everything is stripped away and we're satisfied with only Jesus?
  • 30:20 How do we develop into being satisfied with having nothing but Jesus?
  • 36:39 Micah 6:8 - act justly, love mercy, and walk humbly with your God.
Show more...
5 months ago
42 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Loaded Questions - Can I believe and still have doubts?

Rick and Svea have a robust conversation about doubt. They talk about the connection with doubt, faith, and belief. Are there unsafe questions to ask? They also discuss the role of community in removing doubt.

Resources:
A. J. Swoboda's book, After Doubt

Topics Discussed in this Episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 02:31 Summary of what Svea learned about herself, doubt, and Jesus in preparing for this message.
  • 09:58 1 Corinthians 4: 20 - The kingdom of God isn't a matter of talk but of power.
  • 12:38 What is doubt?
  • 18:00 What do we mean when we talk about faith or belief?
  • 23:40 Is it possible to experience doubt because we're putting expectations on Jesus he never promised?
  • 29:53 How do I know if a question is a safe question to ask? There are no unsafe questions, there are unsafe people.
  • 33:14 Recurring question after the services: how do I know I am saved? How can I have confidence in my salvation?
  • 40:37 You HAVE to invite other people in. Don't struggle by yourself.
  • 45:03 For those who struggle with intellectual doubts.
Show more...
5 months ago
48 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Loaded Questions - Does faith fix mental health?

In this episode Svea is joined by pastors Otis Hall and Jodi Quinn as they look at faith and mental health.

Resources:
Jodi Quinn's email: care@autumnridge.church

Topics Discussed in this Episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 01:21 The number of Americans dealing with mental health issues is staggering.
  • 02:03 We seem to be afraid to talk about mental health.
  • 04:37 Being real about mental health issues. Otis' struggles.
  • 06:42 Prayer and following Jesus doesn't mean all our mental health issues will go away.
  • 08:42 Svea to Otis: how have you felt Jesus support you in your own life.
  • 10:38 Shouldn't I expect that if I believe Jesus I won't have to struggle with mental health?
  • 12:48 The age-old question: why do bad things happen to good people?
  • 14:10 What resources we have available for people who are struggling.
  • 16:56 What would you say to someone who doesn't know Jesus or feels like Jesus has let them down?
  • 18:58 Walking with Jesus isn't an instant cure, but he is a way through.
  • 22:28 Breath prayer.
  • 25:48 Some helpful application points from 1 Peter 5: be humble, cast your anxiety, be courageous.
  • 34:42 Closing prayer.
Show more...
6 months ago
36 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Loaded Questions - Is our church a welcoming place for the LGBTQ Community?

This we we certainly live up to "church is messy." If time allows, we would encourage you to watch the sermon before listening to this podcast. We're also providing a number of resources on the topic of sexuality.

Resources:

  • Sermon Video URL: https://youtu.be/DidFo1xj9ow
  • Center for Faith, Sexuality and Gender (https://www.centerforfaith.com)
  • Greg Coles
  • Preston Sprinkle
  • Rebecca McLaughlin
  • Christopher Yuan
  • Sam Allberry
  • Jackie Hill Perry
  • Mark Yarhouse

Three sermons by Jon Tyson:

  • The Controversial Jesus | Jesus and the Gay Community – Jon Tyson https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqF0MwqjuBU&t=37s
  • The Controversial Jesus | Jesus, Gender, and the Trans Community – Jon Tyson https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IS2oIkfYNwc
  • The Controversial Jesus | Sexual Formation – Jon Tyson https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTGrYxeEZ9U&list=PL8vSjHOSaE12d8ZPujJfxFzcyNlYBActf&index=3

Topics Discussed in this Episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 01:26 Watch the sermon, and avail yourself of the resources we suggest.
  • 06:33 Helpful points from the message
  • 08:53 How can we be welcoming without being affirming?
  • 10:57 It's not the job of a Christian to call out non-Christians. If you have a relationship with a fellow believer then ask "what does it mean to follow Jesus in this area of your life" and have a conversation based on truth and grace.
  • 15:34 How do I love someone well, communicate with my children, and be an ambassador for Christ regarding this topic?
  • 18:31 Pronouns, names, wedding attendance.
  • 22:13 What's wrong with a same-sex relationship that's filled with love? Practicing discernment, truth, and grace.
  • 27:23 Series Thesis: Faith doesn't hide from questions, fear does. What fears are associated with this topic?
  • 31:10 How do we live with courage and engage with people or at work without posturing?
  • 39:23 Why did Rick skip over the topic of incest in 1 Corinthians 5 but address some other issues?
Show more...
6 months ago
47 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Loaded Questions - how do we know what's true?

Rick and Svea answer your questions about truth.

Topics Discussed in this Episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 01:58 Loaded Questions takes on a different format from other messages
  • 06:38 Why does truth matter?
  • 10:51 Is it possible for Christianity to be true and other religions to be true?
  • 15:05 How can we know Scripture is true?
  • 19:06 In Scripture is it possible the authors were biased?
  • 22:48 What do I need God for?
  • 24:43 How can you discern if what you're hearing is from God or the devil?
  • 26:48 Do you obtain knowledge at all? How do the disciples know they saw Jesus?
  • 31:49 How do we know what denominations are teaching truth when they have different beliefs but are still using the Bible as the source of that belief?
  • 35:41 The Apocrypha: Is it true and how is it distinguished from Scripture?
  • 37:23 Jesus' mother, Mary.
  • 39:38 I'm not a Christian for the perks, I'm a Christian because I'm convinced it's true.
Show more...
6 months ago
44 minutes

Church is Messy
Church Is Messy: Galatians - Something to Boast About

Rick and Svea finish off the series on Galatians mostly focusing on burdens, loads, and pride.

Topics Discussed in this Episode:

  • 00:00 Intro
  • 03:26 A LOT of diverse topics to cover is Galatians 6.
  • 04:44 What resonated with Svea that she wasn't able to cover in this passage?
  • 05:41 Carrying our own load and bearing each other's burdens.
  • 11:40 God isn't calling you to fix the people who sinned against you.
  • 17:21 I'm responsible for what I contribute, now necessarily how other people respond.
  • 20:01 How do you tell the difference between someone caught in sin and someone doing something you don't like?
  • 22:00 Presenting pride in the affirmative vs being the root of all sin (the pride Jesus died to forgive vs the pride commended in this passage).
  • 29:14 Swinging on the pendulum of feelings of inferiority and superiority.
  • 34:49 As Christians how do we engage with people and ideas that offer insight into human nature but are deeply hostile to the gospel?
Show more...
6 months ago
48 minutes

Church is Messy
Church is messy podcast recorded at Autumn Ridge Church in Rochester, MN