By Maryanne Demasi at Brownstone dot org.
I recently purchased Aaron Siri's new book Vaccines, Amen. As I flipped through the pages, I noticed a section devoted to his now-famous deposition of Dr Stanley Plotkin, the "godfather" of vaccines.
I'd seen viral clips circulating on social media, but I had never taken the time to read the full transcript - until now.
Siri's interrogation was methodical and unflinching…a masterclass in extracting uncomfortable truths.
A Legal Showdown
In January 2018, Dr Stanley Plotkin, a towering figure in immunology and co-developer of the rubella vaccine, was deposed under oath in Pennsylvania by attorney Aaron Siri.
The case stemmed from a custody dispute in Michigan, where divorced parents disagreed over whether their daughter should be vaccinated. Plotkin had agreed to testify in support of vaccination on behalf of the father.
What followed over the next nine hours, captured in a 400-page transcript, was extraordinary.
Plotkin's testimony revealed ethical blind spots, scientific hubris, and a troubling indifference to vaccine safety data.
He mocked religious objectors, defended experiments on mentally disabled children, and dismissed glaring weaknesses in vaccine surveillance systems.
A System Built on Conflicts
From the outset, Plotkin admitted to a web of industry entanglements.
He confirmed receiving payments from Merck, Sanofi, GSK, Pfizer, and several biotech firms. These were not occasional consultancies but long-standing financial relationships with the very manufacturers of the vaccines he promoted.
Plotkin appeared taken aback when Siri questioned his financial windfall from royalties on products like RotaTeq, and expressed surprise at the "tone" of the deposition.
Siri pressed on: "You didn't anticipate that your financial dealings with those companies would be relevant?"
Plotkin replied: "I guess, no, I did not perceive that that was relevant to my opinion as to whether a child should receive vaccines."
The man entrusted with shaping national vaccine policy had a direct financial stake in its expansion, yet he brushed it aside as irrelevant.
Contempt for Religious Dissent
Siri questioned Plotkin on his past statements, including one in which he described vaccine critics as "religious zealots who believe that the will of God includes death and disease."
Siri asked whether he stood by that statement. Plotkin replied emphatically, "I absolutely do."
Plotkin was not interested in ethical pluralism or accommodating divergent moral frameworks. For him, public health was a war, and religious objectors were the enemy.
He also admitted to using human foetal cells in vaccine production - specifically WI-38, a cell line derived from an aborted foetus at three months' gestation.
Siri asked if Plotkin had authored papers involving dozens of abortions for tissue collection. Plotkin shrugged: "I don't remember the exact number…but quite a few."
Plotkin regarded this as a scientific necessity, though for many people - including Catholics and Orthodox Jews - it remains a profound moral concern.
Rather than acknowledging such sensitivities, Plotkin dismissed them outright, rejecting the idea that faith-based values should influence public health policy.
That kind of absolutism, where scientific aims override moral boundaries, has since drawn criticism from ethicists and public health leaders alike.
As NIH director Jay Bhattacharya later observed during his 2025 Senate confirmation hearing, such absolutism erodes trust.
"In public health, we need to make sure the products of science are ethically acceptable to everybody," he said. "Having alternatives that are not ethically conflicted with foetal cell lines is not just an ethical issue - it's a public health issue."
Safety Assumed, Not Proven
When the discussion turned to safety, Siri asked, "Are you aware of any study that compares vaccinated children to completely unvaccinated children?"
Plotkin replied that he was "not aware of well-controlled s...