What if the toughest environments, the ones steeped in structure, control, and human suffering, were actually spiritual gyms? What if leadership, even inside a prison, was less about control and more about consciousness? My guest today, John Shartle, is a former federal prison warden who led with integrity, empathy, and a deep sense of spiritual grounding.

In this conversation, we talk about the power of presence, the sacredness of a well-prepared meal, and the quiet rebellion of placing books like A New Earth in a prison library. We talk about labyrinths, leadership, and the idea that maybe the path to change, even in the hardest places, starts with small acts of compassion done again and again. I'm so glad you're here for this one.