School Without Walls (SWOW) was a fully democratic school that ran from 1974 to 1997, when it was forced to shut down by Kate Carnell’s Liberal Party local government. Many of those (including myself) who had the opportunity to learn at SWOW remain embittered that something quite that good - many would say life-changing – no longer exists. There are scant records available from SWOW, and this series of oral histories aims to fill that gap as fully as possible. In this interview, we talk with Clive Mackillop, long time teacher from the latter half of SWOW.